# The most screwed-up thing I ever heard of...



## DMGO (Aug 22, 2013)

Listen to this: My daughter (36, married, 3 kids, renting) just called me. She leased a house (2 year lease through a real estate agent) in a really good school district. She's been there over 7 months, paying her rent timely, and rather happy. Today, she finds a note stuck to the front door, saying the house is in forclosure, and must be vacated immediately. So, she calls her landlord, who readily admits that he doesn't own the house, he just makes the HOA payments. He said he would let her out of her lease. What does she do next? Anyone ever hear of nonsense like this? My thoughts are; the bank owns the house, so they can padlock the doors, and confiscate all her stuff. She has no ties to the bank, only the lessor, who doesn't even own the place. HUH?


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## SumDumGuy (Aug 22, 2013)

Several years ago I had a similar thing happen at a duplex. My wife and I ended up leaving. It worked out great as a way for us to get out of the lease (job change).
However, the neighbors stayed and are still there to this day.

If she wants to stay in the house she will be best served by talking with the bank.


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## JMichael (Aug 22, 2013)

If the bank owns the house they can probably padlock the doors but I would think there would have to be some sort of notification and a reasonable amount of time given for her to vacate the house. I have very serious doubts that the bank can prevent her from taking any or all of her possessions, providing she has them out of the house in the time allotted by what ever state laws cover that sort of thing. Even in situations where an owner wants to evict a deadbeat nonpaying renter, there are laws and a process that has to be followed and a certain amount of time that has to pass before they can be removed from the property.


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## dieselfixer (Aug 23, 2013)

I wonder if the bank would sell her the house and agree to payments equal to the rent she is paying?


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## jethro (Aug 23, 2013)

Yikes. What she does next is finds another lease- quick. Her only recourse is to sue the party that she signed a lease with. They committed fraud because they do not own the property. You can't lease a property you don't own. The only good part is that there is a very good chance she will be able to get a judgement for all that rent money back. Doesn't mean she will be able to collect it, but still. Bottom line is, when you get that note on the door, the property transfer is imminent. Like possibly within 30 days.


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## earl60446 (Aug 23, 2013)

That house is her home, she has rights. Homes go into foreclosure but a sheriffs eviction is what it takes to make many people leave and in most areas, the courts are way behind in processing evictions. You also get 30 days prior notice to eviction so you might be able to stay there for free* for quite a while.
Talk to a lawyer.


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## Inkd (Aug 23, 2013)

[url=https://www.tinboats.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=327132#p327132 said:


> earl60446 » 7 minutes ago[/url]"]That house is her home, she has rights. Homes go into foreclosure but a sheriffs eviction is what it takes to make many people leave and in most areas, the courts are way behind in processing evictions. You also get 30 days prior notice to eviction so you might be able to stay there for free* for quite a while.
> Talk to a lawyer.



I agree just a note isn't gonna cut it, the bank would have to go to court and have eviction papers drawn up and served to your daughter, giving her at least 30 days to vacate the premises. I would say the way the courts are going right now she has probably 6 months or better but I would keep making the rent payments. So they cant effect her credit rating.


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## GTS225 (Aug 23, 2013)

[url=https://www.tinboats.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=327051#p327051 said:


> DMGO » Yesterday, 19:44[/url]"]Listen to this: My daughter (36, married, 3 kids, renting) just called me. She leased a house (2 year lease through a real estate agent) in a really good school district. She's been there over 7 months, paying her rent timely, and rather happy. Today, she finds a note stuck to the front door, saying the house is in forclosure, and must be vacated immediately. So, she calls her landlord, who readily admits that he doesn't own the house, he just makes the HOA payments. He said he would let her out of her lease. What does she do next? Anyone ever hear of nonsense like this? My thoughts are; the bank owns the house, so they can padlock the doors, and confiscate all her stuff. She has no ties to the bank, only the lessor, who doesn't even own the place. HUH?


********************************************************************************************************

I'm just an "armchair lawyer", so take anything I say with a heavy sprinkling of salt.
"She leased a house": Does she still have a copy of the lease? If so, she needs to lawyer up and file fraud charges against this so-called "real estate agent". With a lawyer, she'll be able to find out if he's legitimately acting as the "owner's" agent. If he is legitimate, then the "real estate agent" is off the hook, to a degree.
You say he "just makes the HOA payments". So, how much rent does she pay a month, how much are the HOA payments, and what's he doing with the difference? If he's sending it on to the "owner", (who apparently isn't making the mortgage payments), then I suspect the lawsuit could then extend to them, as the contract was made in good faith on her part, but broken in bad faith on thier part.

I highly doubt that she can file any complaint against the bank, as they most likely aren't in the information loop. (Might be now, but they weren't when all this started.) She does need to have her lawyer contact the bank and advise them as to what's going on, and maybe even open dialogue about taking over the mortgage. (Better yet, renegotiate for a better sale price, as the housing market is still slumped, and from what a "snowbird" friend of mine says, pretty badly in Florida.)
As far as the foreclosure is concerned, that takes quite some time. As the others said, typically six months or longer, so she doesn't need to get out by the end of next week. If she gets a lawyer involved, that might stretch out to a year.

This "note" stuck to her door. Was it a handwritten note, typed, official bank letterhead stationary, legal document, or what? A handwritten note could have been stuck there by anybody, even a (heaven forbid) stalker. Hopefully, she still has this note in her possession. 

Either way, she needs to get herself legal counsel that specializes in real estate and leased/rental property.

Good luck.....Roger


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## Colbyt (Aug 23, 2013)

Rather than play Internet lawyer, I would suggest she contact tenant services in the community where she lives. Unless fraud was committed she definitely has some legal rights. Also the foreclosing bank might be content to let her stay pending a sale. Properly executed leases are a binding contract.


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## nomowork (Aug 23, 2013)

My son bought a house that was bank owned a few years ago. The neighbor told us that the previous "owner" was in foreclosure and was living there a year before the sheriffs physically removed him from the house. 

I have heard of other renters who lived in houses for over a year without paying rent because they knew their legal rights (which I don't know anything about). Maybe the landlord was in this same situation.

Kind of sucks for your daughter though.


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## Kojak5150 (Sep 2, 2013)

This situation happened to use a few years ago. They gave us 90 days notice to get or they would pay us $3K to get out within 30 days. So we took that money and found another place. I have heard it called "Cash for Keys" Program.


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## Captain Ahab (Sep 2, 2013)

[url=https://www.tinboats.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=328175#p328175 said:


> Kojak5150 » Mon Sep 02, 2013 12:18 pm[/url]"]This situation happened to use a few years ago. They gave us 90 days notice to get or they would pay us $3K to get out within 30 days. So we took that money and found another place. I have heard it called "Cash for Keys" Program.




And that my friends is her option

She should contact the bank and provide them with a lease - they cannot toss her out without going through evictions proceedings - so instead of doing so they will do a "cash for keys" with her


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## DocWatson (Sep 3, 2013)

[url=https://www.tinboats.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=328189#p328189 said:


> Captain Ahab » Mon Sep 02, 2013 5:37 pm[/url]"]
> 
> 
> [url=https://www.tinboats.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=328175#p328175 said:
> ...



Good answer Dave. That and to put the police on her "landlord". Pretty sure it's not legal to rent a house you don't own or have any rights to. Wonder how many other places the guy has and is "renting" out ???


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## kensho1976 (Sep 3, 2013)

Check the Helping Families Save Their Homes Act of 2009, and the Protecting Tenants at Foreclosure Act of 2011.

We were going to rent a home that was just purchased by an investor, but we couldn't find any info on said investor, so we looked up our rights.

You'll have to look up the specifics, but I believe they either have to intice you to move by paying you, or you get to finish some or all of your lease. 

"Establishes protections for renters living in foreclosed homes One of the often overlooked problems in the foreclosure crisis has been the eviction of renters in good standing, through no fault of their own, from properties in foreclosure. To address the problem of these tenants being forced out of their homes with little or no notice, this legislation will require that in the event of foreclosure, existing leases for renters are honored, except in the case of month-to-month leases or owner occupants foreclosing in which cases a minimum of 90 days notice will be required. Parallel protections are put in place for Section 8 tenants."

https://m.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/reforms-american-homeowners-and-consumers-president-obama-signs-helping-families-sa


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## Ranchero50 (Sep 3, 2013)

Ditto, they can't lock her out. They have to go through the courts. It's 6 months of free rent for her, what's to complain about.


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## DMGO (Sep 3, 2013)

This jerk that rented the house to my daughter leases about 20 different homes. He told her it wasn't really illegal, as long as he pays the HOA dues on each home. I'm 'old-school'. I never heard of crap like this before.


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## Captain Ahab (Sep 4, 2013)

[url=https://www.tinboats.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=328286#p328286 said:


> DMGO » Tue Sep 03, 2013 1:39 pm[/url]"]This jerk that rented the house to my daughter leases about 20 different homes. He told her it wasn't really illegal, as long as he pays the HOA dues on each home. I'm 'old-school'. I never heard of crap like this before.




Have you contacted your Local District Attorney or the State Attorney General yet? If not - DO IT!


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## DocWatson (Sep 4, 2013)

[url=https://www.tinboats.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=328371#p328371 said:


> Captain Ahab » Wed Sep 04, 2013 10:55 am[/url]"]
> 
> 
> [url=https://www.tinboats.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=328286#p328286 said:
> ...



X2 !!!!!! That's fraud and the guy is a crook !!!!!


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## jethro (Sep 5, 2013)

20 Homes? Call your local TV news station too, they love these types of stories!


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## kensho1976 (Sep 5, 2013)

It is not illegal to do so, at least in Florida. The ownership of the home is retained by the current owner until the foreclosure is finalized. Therefore, the current owner can continue to collect rent. 

It is in my opinion, however, immoral.


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## JMichael (Sep 5, 2013)

[url=https://www.tinboats.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=328486#p328486 said:


> kensho1976 » Today, 12:49[/url]"]It is not illegal to do so, at least in Florida. The ownership of the home is retained by the current owner until the foreclosure is finalized. Therefore, the current owner can continue to collect rent.
> 
> It is in my opinion, however, immoral.


If I'm reading this correctly, then no, the current owner can not continue to collect rent. The lease agreement is between the daughter and a third party, there is no agreement what so ever between the actual owner of the property and his daughter. Besides, it sounds like the bank is taking or already has possession of the property so there's not much point in trying to make some arrangements with the owner either.


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## DocWatson (Sep 7, 2013)

[url=https://www.tinboats.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=328486#p328486 said:


> kensho1976 » Thu Sep 05, 2013 2:49 pm[/url]"]It is not illegal to do so, at least in Florida. The ownership of the home is retained by the current owner until the foreclosure is finalized. Therefore, the current owner can continue to collect rent.
> 
> It is in my opinion, however, immoral.



It is NOT illegal for the OWNER to rent the property. It is, however, HIGHLY ILLEGAL for a third party with no financial interest in a property to take posession of and rent out a home they do not own and simply pay the HOA dues until the bank takes it or the owner returns.

Would it be illegal or immoral if some stranger rented your house out, to some random person who answered a Craig's List ad, while you were on vacation ??? Just askin'. :wink:


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## kensho1976 (Sep 8, 2013)

Not sure why you're directing the question and tone at me, since we're all armchair lawyers here - unless you have some jurist doctorate I'm not aware of. The only qualifications I have are being in a similar situation, and working for law enforcement that does the evictions, so you should take my comments as such.

If you have links to back up your statements, it may help the OP. The acts I posted may only work if the realtor was working on behalf of the owner.

Realtors usually act on behalf of someone, whether it is the owner, investor, bank, etc. They themselves must have legal standing to rent the house, so they enter into a contract with the owners to do so. 

Since we do not know everything about the situation (we know maybe half of the story), I was assuming the realtor did indeed enter into a contract and was acting on the owners behalf. 

If he wasn't, then I fail to see any legally binding contract taking place and probably a hint of fraud. If he was, then I would imagine the acts I mentioned previously should hold sway. 

I imagine the situation as an investor/realtor scenario. If she checks her lease, is it signed completely by the realtor, or is it signed by the owner? 

And honestly, here in FL, I dont believe the HOA fees have to be paid. We're renting a nice home from a well known investment company that bought it in foreclosure. The HOA fees had not been paid in two years. The only recourse the HOA had was to not let us use the amenities (pool, tennis courts, etc) until the fees were paid. We also had a realtor that represented the investment company, and all of our lease documents have the investment company's signature on them, not the realtor's.

The OP should find out, if he hasn't already. Any information we give is never a good substitute for getting a lawyers opinion. Unfortunately, sometimes hiring a lawyer to fight it may be more expensive than just leaving.


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## DocWatson (Sep 10, 2013)

[url=https://www.tinboats.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=328699#p328699 said:


> kensho1976 » Sun Sep 08, 2013 11:08 am[/url]"]Not sure why you're directing the question and tone at me, since we're all armchair lawyers here - unless you have some jurist doctorate I'm not aware of. The only qualifications I have are being in a similar situation, and working for law enforcement that does the evictions, so you should take my comments as such.
> 
> If you have links to back up your statements, it may help the OP. The acts I posted may only work if the realtor was working on behalf of the owner.
> 
> ...



No tone, just emphasis. Sorry if it was misunderstood.  Writing is such an imperfect communication medium. 

My comments stem from working with the condo association board in the 0ver 55 where I live. We have been having problems with vacant units since the real estate crash in '08. One in particular was being "rented" by the former son in law of the owner, who had been moved into a nursing home. He collected rent, but never paid the mortgage or condo fees. It took the police almost 6 months to find out who he was and arrest him. The unit is in foreclosure, the owner has died and our association has a lawsuit pending against the guy and a lien on the unit for back condo fees owed. This guy was a real estate agent who knew the ropes and was scamming the system. All his documentation given to the "tenant" was very legit looking. Just some incorrect information about the Realtor behind the transaction. Like the fact that they even existed !!!!

My statement here regarded what appears to be another crooked realtor scamming a tenant and then having the stones to tell them it was OK. Here's a link regarding the legality of this stuff in Florida.

"Q: Can you rent a foreclosed home?

A: Yes, however, you must (in Florida) disclose it is in foreclosure, the bank can take the rent money from you, or the new renters can decide not to pay you since you aren’t paying your taxes, or mortgage. So you get to keep you home for nothing and they get to live in a house for nothing."

Patricia Baker is a REALTOR® with Leslie Wells Realty, Inc. in Parrish, FL.


And, here's a link to the legal solutions in Florida. But, as you pointed out, we're all armchair lawyers (except Ahab) and for legal advice one should seek the advice of an attorney. Provided, of course, that one has the requisite spare $100,000 and first-born male heir to give said attorney in return for their advise. :wink:


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## Jbennett (Sep 10, 2013)

She can definitely stay. She has tenants rights. I've heard of people in foreclosure"I'm a realtor" leasing the house to a girlfriend just to throw a kink in things.


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## simbelle (Sep 10, 2013)

Someone may have said this already but....Realtors and banks know that Homes sell faster if they are occupied, have her talk to the bank.


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## lswoody (Sep 13, 2013)

What Simbelle said


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