# Need a motor!



## Kustrud (Dec 19, 2014)

Hey guys, new here, picking up a 2015 War Eagle 648 tomorrow. I need a motor and some places have a 25 HP limit. Found a 1972 Chrysler the guy says it runs great. I'm pretty good with motors and mechanics, but not too familiar with outboards. Is this too old to bother with or if it's in good shape should I be OK? I can get it with a gas tank for $300.


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## Theman543 (Dec 20, 2014)

Hello, I don't have much experience with chrysler outboards but I have heard that it can be hard to get parts for those motors that are earlier than 1975 or 74. Not sure if that is true but I would look to see if they still make impellers, ignition parts, and carb kits just in case something goes bad down the line. Also, even if parts are available and the motor runs good, I think $300 is a bit high. Where I'm from a motor like that would probably go for $200 or so but your market may be different. Best of luck with your new purchases!


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## Captain Ahab (Dec 20, 2014)

Offer less that is an old motor with points


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## Kustrud (Dec 20, 2014)

Thanks guys, what ya mean with points?


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## RStewart (Dec 20, 2014)

The ignition system is points & condenser not electronic just like the old cars had points distributors. Some people like them but I prefer electronic. However, that wouldn't deter me from buying it if the price was right & it was in good shape.


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## Kustrud (Dec 20, 2014)

Gotcha, thanks! Hmm.....I'll send a link to it


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## Kustrud (Dec 20, 2014)

Ok so I did some research. No thanks on the Chrysler. How about this? Anyone know what year this would roughly be? I'm thinking mid to late 70's, the guy doesn't know but just from the pics it wasn't used hard. Anyone know anything about this motor please let me know. Good era? Stay away? Still get parts? Easy/cheap to fix? Thanks! 

https://atlanta.craigslist.org/nat/boa/4812634887.html


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## flintcreek (Dec 20, 2014)

Well my personal preference is the old Johnson's and Evinrude's. What ever you buy you should run a compression check. Tune up parts are readily available for the old OMC motors and they are easy to work on if you buy a manual. Good move staying away from the Chrysler and Force motors in my opinion. I like the old Mercury's also but they are harder for me to work on.


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## BloodStone (Dec 21, 2014)

Kustrud said:


> Hey guys, new here, picking up a 2015 War Eagle 648 tomorrow. I need a motor and some places have a 25 HP limit. Found a 1972 Chrysler the guy says it runs great. I'm pretty good with motors and mechanics, but not too familiar with outboards. Is this too old to bother with or if it's in good shape should I be OK? I can get it with a gas tank for $300.



*STAY AWAY! 
Chrysler's are in general a real B*tch to find parts for & when you do, it's usually bend over time $$. Plus, the Chrysler Marine division went belly up almost 30 years ago. Not a big fan of older Mercs either (mid 70's-80's), the parts aren't as hard to find as a Chrysler but, they sure ain't cheap either (usually). Even though I've never owned a "Force" motor, I've heard more often than not, that they're just crap. Imo better to stick to the 1978 & newer Evinrudes & Johnsons (dependable IF they've been at least halfway cared for). Most "JohnnyRudes" are pretty easy to find parts for & the parts generally won't bust your bank account either. OR...If money isn't too much of an issue, it's really tough to beat a Honda 4 stroke (of almost any year). I currently own a 25hp Mariner & a 40hp Nissan (both non-tiller) & so far I love both.
*


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## Kustrud (Dec 21, 2014)

Thanks and that's kinda what I'm gathering from reading as well. So help me here, I want to spend around $500 and will spend up to $1,000 on a good deal/motor. What should I look for and where can I look besides CL?


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## JMichael (Dec 21, 2014)

Kustrud said:


> Ok so I did some research. No thanks on the Chrysler. How about this? Anyone know what year this would roughly be? I'm thinking mid to late 70's, the guy doesn't know but just from the pics it wasn't used hard. Anyone know anything about this motor please let me know. Good era? Stay away? Still get parts? Easy/cheap to fix? Thanks!
> 
> https://atlanta.craigslist.org/nat/boa/4812634887.html


That appears to be a 1974 model. I acquired a 75 model a few years back. Converted it from remote to tiller steer and added electric start (not that it needed it, it started so easy). After sprucing it up a bit and running it for one season, I decided I wanted more power on my boat. I found a Mariner 25hp and ended up selling my Merc to a friend. He's been running it hard for 2 years now and last I spoke to him, he said it was still purring like a kitten. 





I had to search ebay for most of the parts I needed but they weren't difficult to find. You just have to be willing to use second hand parts for some things like the tiller, but water and fuel pump kits/parts were easy to find and from what I could tell, comparably priced to other mfg parts. BTW, I sold that motor for $650 as it appears in the pic.


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## turbotodd (Dec 22, 2014)

Keep your eyes out for a Yamaha. 

3 cylinder 25 would be ideal (basically a de-tuned 30hp). But a twin cylinder twin carb 25 is a really lightweight motor that, if cared for, is one tough motor. And don't discount a good 4 stroke 25 either. That is what I have and I wouldn't go back to a 2 stroke unless I was paid to. Mine's on a 548 LDV War Eagle. Love that rig. VERY little maintenance is needed and by far my favorite boat I've had, and I've had a bunch. Funny, I was talking to my dad about it the other day and he was saying that he thought I'd never get rid of the 14 footer (1432) that's got the old evinrude 9.9 on it. I kept it-still got it actually (I gave it to dad to use) but I hate the recoil starter, I hate how slow it is, the throttle linkages are worn out, and I drown in smoke when I fire it up the first time. Owned it since it was 2 months old, 1984 model, about 25 hours run time on it total. We never used it much other than idling onto the and off of the trailer and that's about it. Clean the carb twice a year, which is a pain in the butt compared to most of the Yamaha's I've worked on. Last time I had dad's on the lake, I had to put a rope on the starter....hate that design. And that little thing is tough to start via rope starter. For whatever reason, it seems like it's got 500 psi compression. Gauge says 120 on both. Also had an older 25 johnson, hated it too. Single carb/twin cylinder. Rougher running than I'm used to, liked gas, liked to be fixed from time to time. And smoked horribly when it was cold. Once you made a wide open run, it'd clear up and was good to go all the rest of the day, but sometimes I didn't get that opportunity to run wide open (stumps, rocks, etc). Always had to carry some extra spark plugs. I actually traded that thing on the water (well at the ramp)...guy in anotherhboat had a 25 Yamaha twin cylinder twin carb motor that sat for a long time, he commented how clean the Johnson was and I told him I'd trade...jokingly...and he said ok yeah. The Yamaha ran perfect. And being it was a 100:1 fuel/oil mix, lot less smoke.

I saw a 25 triple (3 cylinder) Yamaha with a Panther PT&T on another site for $3,000...surprised it hasn't sold yet. Sometimes you can drive a little and pick up stuff cheap. 25's in this area are gold because of the public hunting areas' 25hp limits. I had 2 of the 4 strokes, kept one, sold the other the same day it went on CL, $2400. Elsewhere in the country, it'd have been a $1000 motor, at best. The other side of that deal is that a lot of the used 25' s are used up. The flooded timber takes it's toll. Skegs busted, bent/broken props, foots that are destroyed, etc. Another advantage of Yamaha, the shift dog pin in the foot is cheezy...little 5mm piece of steel, it will break if you hit something hard enough, and it gets hard to shift into/out of gear. Takes 10 minutes to fix it due to the design of the foot.

the older points ignition motors are headaches, unless you know how to work on 'em and keep 'em running. Most of the Chrysler stuff needs to be in the scrap iron pile. Some guys still collect them, though.


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## GarryB (Dec 22, 2014)

Just FYI I bout a 90 model precision blend 30hp 3cyl yamaha in near mint condition (hood was faded) for a grand on CL. Prob best 1k I've ever spent.


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## BloodStone (Dec 22, 2014)

Kustrud said:


> Thanks and that's kinda what I'm gathering from reading as well. So help me here, I want to spend around $500 and will spend up to $1,000 on a good deal/motor. What should I look for and where can I look besides CL?



Well CL is almost always my 1st choice. Then Ebay & if no luck there maybe a "boat broker" or auction. However, I strongly suggest that with Ebay that you choose a somewhat local seller so you can see & hear the motor running 1st hand BEFORE you plunk down your $$ (never buy 'blind'). If possible, make sure they tank test the OB to see if it's pumping water & how it well it performs on a higher RPM (misses, stall outs etc..). A compression test is a must (make sure all [examined] spark plugs are removed before you start testing each cylinder). If the cylinders are within 5-10psi variations of each other, then it's ok (should read no lower than 80psi per cylinder imo, better to be 100psi plus ). Also very important, is to check the Lower Unit gear lube & see what color & texture it is (usually two small big headed bolts on the side of the LU near the prop). If the lube comes out looking like a vanilla milk shake, or water comes out first before the oil...NOT good! Walk away (if any of the 3 previously mentioned undesirable scenarios happen to play out). And for a grand, you MIGHT be able to snag an older 25hp Honda (my 1st choice) or like a previous poster said, a Yamaha. Nissan would be my next choice (I own 2) & are usually are cheaper in price than a Honda or Yamaha but, are still pretty damn good motors. If no luck on the previously mention OB fronts, I'd then go with as new a Johnson or Evinrude as I could afford. A final bit of trivial info; Johnsons usually start better stone cold than Mercs but, once Mercs are warmed up good, they start pretty easily from then on (well, that's the case with my Mariner anyway). The newer Mercs (2000-2014), I am not familiar with.


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## Kustrud (Dec 22, 2014)

Awesome, and great info guys! I appreciate all of the help.....here are some eBay deals I have found:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Mercury-25HP-Outboard-Motor-Remote-Short-Shaft-/171605823243?pt=Boat_Parts_Accessories_Gear&hash=item27f4810f0b&vxp=mtr 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/JOHNSON-EVINRUDE-25-hp-2-STROKE-OUTBOARD-15-BOAT-MOTOR-Short-Shaft-Remote-/351260022189?pt=Boat_Parts_Accessories_Gear&hash=item51c8ba95ad&vxp=mtr

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Johnson-25-HP-short-shaft-outboard-motor-/281512736516?pt=Boat_Parts_Accessories_Gear&hash=item418b777704&vxp=mtr

Give me soem feedback on these so I know what to look for!

I will most likely go the CL route. What kind of compression tester do I need, how do I use it, and where do I get it?

Thanks!


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## gillhunter (Dec 22, 2014)

Are you looking for a tiller or remote? The first 2 are remotes. Does your War Eagle have a console, or is it set up for a tiller?


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## Kustrud (Dec 22, 2014)

Dang guess I didnt even read that far into em - tiller!


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## Boat2fast (Dec 22, 2014)

You gotta run it.

There is no way to tell how good a motor is without running it. Perfect compression is good unless the bearings are making noises. If the powerhead is tight it will sound tight, nice and quiet. If it's loose and slappy or buzzy or rappy, clicky, whiny, thumpy....

Take someone with you who has experience.

If you stumble into a situation where the motor is _obviously_ hardly used, an estate sale or other long term storage scenario, then it may be wise to take a chance right away. It's an immediate decision. Can go really well or not. 

Sellers will often lie...or at least talk around the truth. They will tell you everything there is to know about the motor except what they fear is wrong with it. Ask lots of questions. Beware of answers like: "It ran fine last time I used it." or "I think it needs a tune up.", "The carb needs cleaning", "It might need a water pump".
If you can't hear it AND like it, then the next step is to figure it for _parts or repair_. The step below that is scrap value minus handling cost.

Other things to check:
(1)Paint and finish. How an engine appears reflects considerably on its _value_. You can get an excellent idea how it was treated by the surface condition. I see engines all the time owner telling me what low hours it has. I look down and all the paint is worn off the skeg. It takes a lot of hours to do that. Either that or someone ran it through the bottom all the time.
(2)Steering/mounting bracket. Look for looseness and play. Look for evidence of lubrication. Is everything dry and stiff? Do the clamps turn sticky or jam up? Tilt linkage loose or rusted? Shift linkage nice? Stains/leaks?
(3)Lower unit. Take out the lower fluid screw enough to let a few drops seep out on your finger. Any water? Milky colored oil? Metal sparkles?
(4)Look for evidence of overheating like scorched paint toward the back of the cylinders. Look for salt corrosion. Motors from salt environments are terrible to take apart for service.

Spend as much time with the engine as you can BEFORE handing over the cash. That's when you want to find the problems. Don't jump on the first old piece of junk you run across just because you want one quick. Wait for the right engine at the right price. It's out there.


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## Kustrud (Dec 23, 2014)

Thanks for the reply 2fast. Good info! Check out this motor in the link. I'm gonna call and ask some questions tomorrow. Anyone know what year, good/bad, model, general info. from looking at the pic?

I can't tell if it's a long or short, I need a short though. 

https://atlanta.craigslist.org/atl/boa/4814994196.html


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## BloodStone (Dec 23, 2014)

> Give me soem feedback on these so I know what to look for!
> I will most likely go the CL route. What kind of compression tester do I need, how do I use it, and where do I get it?
> Thanks!




Boat2Fast gave you some good sound advise (same as mine only he elaborated more & gave you other things to watch out for). 
In regards to..https://atlanta.craigslist.org/atl/boa/4814994196.html; that motor looks like a long shaft & looks decent enough but again, follow Boat2Fast's sage advise & chances are you'll be ok.
Harbor Freight has a compression tester kit with 3 hoses with 3 different size ends. 
The kit should contain instructions on how to use the tester, just make sure ALL the spark plugs are out before you start testing. If you have no Harbor Freight near you, try a Sears or your local auto parts place or simply borrow one.
In regards to the motors/links you provided to various Ebay auctions, imo I think they're all a little over-priced. 
I'd try CL thoroughly first before I decided on going the Ebay route. But keep in mind, you're hunting for an OB at really the wrong time of the year (winter). Kinda like looking for snowmobiles during the summer time. Spring is the best time to start hunting for deals on boats & OB motors imo (well here in the Midwest it is, I don't know about down south). 
Good luck!


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## JMichael (Dec 23, 2014)

Down south, you'll see more boats and motor for sale in the spring but that's also the time you'll pay the most for them because every jacks their prices up for the start of spring fishing. If you can locate what you're looking for, you'll get your best price in the off season typically.


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## Boat2fast (Dec 23, 2014)

Those Evinrudes like that are well worth considering. I find them easy to work on and generally reliable. That one, at the link, is a shortshaft tiller. It doesn't have the long midsection. It is not particularly pretty...but there's nothing else to go on without seeing it up close. I can see from the photo that the lower unit has a broken skeg and the lower unit paint has been spray-bombed. The prop looks like it been run through the bottom a lot. The motor has spent a lot of time in the sun. The cover is from a 1996, maybe the whole motor is. No pictures with the hood off. For a grand asking price...it doesn't look like a money maker. These are my first impressions _from the ad_.

The next step is deciding if you want to invest the time to hear it run. That requires a phone call. Stay away from deals where the seller just wants to text all day. This requires person to person communication. Listening skills are needed here. Try to ascertain how the seller views the equipment. If he is trying to make a buck, If he is trying to get rid of it, If he doesn't want to fix it, find out the real reason he wants to sell. Always be ready to move on to the next deal.

Always be friendly and respectful when speaking with buyers and sellers. You are trying to learn as much about the engine and the seller as you can in the short time available. That information is what you process into an offer or decision.

I remember reading some good advice in the Bible. Maybe it is appropriate here. 

Proverbs 27:12
The shrewd person sees the danger and conceals himself,
But the inexperienced keep right on going and suffer the consequences.

Proverbs 14:15
The naive person believes every word,
But the shrewd one ponders each step.


Imagine the trouble this advice might save a person.


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## Kustrud (Dec 23, 2014)

Alright 2fast - your my motor guy - you clearly know motors, and I apprecaite it. Ill pass on that first Evinrude as I noticed some of those same things. I found a couple of good ones, see links below. I think I can get the 2002 (called him - motor only) for $1,000 and the other for around $500......thoughts??

https://atlanta.craigslist.org/nat/boa/4814111500.html 


https://atlanta.craigslist.org/nat/boa/4815903911.html (just noticed this has controls damn it)


Getting better yet? That first one too old, or are those OK as long as they check out?


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## jasper60103 (Dec 23, 2014)

Kustrud said:


> Alright 2fast - your my motor guy - you clearly know motors, and I apprecaite it. Ill pass on that first Evinrude as I noticed some of those same things. I found a couple of good ones, see links below. I think I can get the 2002 (called him - motor only) for $1,000 and the other for around $500......thoughts??
> 
> https://atlanta.craigslist.org/nat/boa/4814111500.html
> 
> ...



The merc is not a tiller, if that's what you're looking for?


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## BloodStone (Dec 23, 2014)

I might go with the Merc BUT, as Jasper noticed, it's not a tiller (plus as B2F pointed out, the skeg looks like it was busted once & welded/repaired-how did it happen is what I'd ask the seller). And to possibly convert this Merc to a tiller could prove to be quiet costly. Have you found any Hondas, Yamahas, or Nissans in your searches? If that 76 Evinrude checks out ok & IF you can get it for $500.00, that might be a good deal (check with your local marina & see how accessible the parts for that particular motor still are.). Finally, I know the old 1978-1983 (or so) Johnson _Sea Horses_ are tough little "tanks" (& as B2F said, pretty easy to work on), so that might be another option for you. _Patience_ is indeed a _virtue_ when searching for a good dependable OB (lots of scammers lurking out there).


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## Kustrud (Dec 23, 2014)

Yeah I noticed that on the Merc as well......here is another one.

This guy seems to have a bunch - would let it go for $1,000.

Looks like a well-kept motor from the pics.

1989 Evinrudes worth a damn?

https://atlanta.craigslist.org/nat/boa/4813395349.html

WOuld that be enough for a WE 648??

Im 230 lbs. and would typically have 1-2 others with me in the 180 lb range.


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## Kustrud (Dec 23, 2014)

This one too

https://atlanta.craigslist.org/atl/boa/4814994196.html

https://atlanta.craigslist.org/nat/bod/4796740825.html


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## jasper60103 (Dec 24, 2014)

Kustrud said:


> ...
> 
> 1989 Evinrudes worth a damn?
> 
> ...



I have a 88' 30 hp Johnson and I'm pleased with that motor. The 20 hp is basically the
same, even shares the same block, but different manifold and carb. And yea, there's a good thread here on converting it to a 30 hp if desired.

So you're basically looking at staying at a 25hp or less due to lake restrictions.
I believe your hull is rated at 40 hp, correct?
A 20 hp will probably push it ok, but not super fast. JMO.

-jasper


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## jasper60103 (Dec 24, 2014)

Kustrud said:


> This one too
> 
> https://atlanta.craigslist.org/atl/boa/4814994196.html
> 
> https://atlanta.craigslist.org/nat/bod/4796740825.html



One question you need to consider is, do you want electric start?

I don't think either tiller motor in above ads have electric start.
Of course, buying the pair of Evinrudes in the second ad may give
you the option of converting the tiller motor to electric start, and you'll
have parts to spare. Which may be a good thing as I think these 
are probably project motors. But before making assumptions though, I would confirm the motors are
compatible first. 
Not trying to discourage you, but someone probably traded them in for
good reason. But there's risk in buying any used motor though. JMO. 
Good luck.

-jasper


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## Boat2fast (Dec 24, 2014)

The Mercs are pretty easy to convert to tiller. Kits available for 1994 1/2 and up.

JMichael mentioned that Spring might be a good time to look. They all come out of the woodwork then.

The 1989 Evinrude 20 looked like it might be worth a call. A big carb really perks 'em up. Evinrude/Johnsons are over 100cc bigger than the Merc/Mariners.

There is a big reservoir nearby with a 20hp limit. Hotrod 20s are valuable around here. Jonboats are not allowed on the main part of the reservoir, only v-hulls. Also, the boat needs to be rated for twice the engine. A boat rated for 40hp is required to have a 20hp. If your boat is rated for 15, you can only use a 7.5hp. Funny rules up there. Quabbin Reservoir.


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## turbotodd (Dec 25, 2014)

An autozone universal compression tester is fine. Most of the outboards are 14mm spark plugs anywhere, which is what most older cars and trucks used, so normally the universal fit compression tester works. When you get into the 4 stroke stuff, some of those use smaller spark plug threads and you'd need the proper adapter (some are 12mm, some are 10mm)

https://lakeland.craigslist.org/bar/4784205259.html Saltwater use???
https://charlotte.craigslist.org/boa/4812386245.html
https://blacksburg.craigslist.org/boa/4810741885.html
https://memphis.craigslist.org/boa/4815758787.html
https://easternshore.craigslist.org/boa/4819017612.html
https://jonesboro.craigslist.org/boa/4800837114.html
https://cenla.craigslist.org/boa/4767402897.html
https://ventura.craigslist.org/boa/4799929350.html This one is a steal!!
https://pensacola.craigslist.org/boa/4791270342.html Hmmm...I may have to make a road trip to pick this one up!

Them are just a few. They're out there. Searching is easy. Take your pick, do you want 2 stroke or 4 stroke? 4 stroke holds it's value better, IMO. If you didn't like the 4 stroke, put it back on the market and it'll go. Them old 2 stroke motors are starting to die out slowly, some parts are being phased out and there's not much other choice but to buy another used motor or go with a new 4 stroke, or spend a LOT of money for one of them expensive ETEC's, which weigh a ton and cost a fortune...kind of defeating the purpose of 2 stroke, IMO.


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## Kustrud (Dec 27, 2014)

Thanks again for all the advice. Went and looked at a bunch of em today. Not feeling too great. I think I have settled on this one to see next. Skeg looks broken at the tip hut other than that looks clean enough. Called the guy today and he said he will run a compression test with me there. Rebuilt the carb, new impeller, changed the gear oil in the lower unit, and ran a leak down test. Firm in price but I think $750 will do it. Opinions?? Going to see it in the AM. 

https://atlanta.craigslist.org/atl/boa/4814994196.html


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## BloodStone (Dec 28, 2014)

> Opinions?? Going to see it in the AM.



WATER TEST IT if possible! 
(be better if you could test it on an actual boat in the water & under a load instead of just in a barrel but..)


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## Kustrud (Dec 28, 2014)

He said we can run it, keep ya posted.


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## Kustrud (Dec 28, 2014)

Also, what's the best way to pain these things? I want it to look nice too so will be repainting it. Easiest way to get the old stuff off? Good stuff to use?


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## Pappy (Dec 28, 2014)

The OEM colors in spray cans are still available for those years. OEM decals are also available I believe. 
Normal de-greasing and paint prep are all that is necessary. I have done a few this way with good results, however I let the spray can paint harden over about a week before the engine goes in the water. Very good paint if you do it this way.


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## Kustrud (Dec 28, 2014)

So I got it for $800 2000 Evinrude 25 hp compression is 130 on both cylinders gear oil and lower unit look good starts in one pool shifts smoothly forward and reverse were good motor looks brand-new under the hood. (Talking into phone excuse the grammar.) Guy said he worked for Evinrude for 25 years and seemed pretty honest and explain a lot about these motors to me as well said he does not know when the impeller was changed last should I go ahead and do this to be safe? How'd I do?


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## JMichael (Dec 28, 2014)

IMO, the single biggest part to achieving a decent paint job is like pappy said, preparation, preparation, preparation. The new paint can't look great if you don't start with a clean canvas and in this case, the canvas is a chipped and scratched up surface. Degrease it first to make sanding or blasting easier. You can sand and feather the edges of all the chips and scratches, or you can use sandblasting or paint stripper to completely remove the old paint. If you can slide your finger over a chipped area and feel the chip, it will ruin an otherwise nice paint job. Keep in mind that you'll want to use some etching primer on any bare metal. 

I started with this 





Ended with this





I couldn't justify the expense of new decals at the time so I just covered all the old decals with masking take and gave the rest some new color. I'd estimate that 80% of the total labor for this job was spent doing prep work (cleaning, sanding, masking, etc).


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