# 1956 Johnson QD-17 Project NEW QUESTIONS



## BassBlaster

I have gotten several requests for updates on the outboard I just purchaced so I thought I would start a project thread for it where I can update my progress. I have a trailer project thread and boat project thread, might as well have a motor project thread too, lol. This is a 1956 Johnson Sea Horse 10 HP, Mod. QD-17.
This thing is completely original and in amazing condition. My original plan was to buy an old motor so I could paint it to match the boat which I had planned to do in a camo pattern. I never dreamed I was gonna buy an old motor that looks like this so there is no way I'm painting this thing!! It looks so good it actually has me reconsidering my plan to camo the boat. Might look strange with a bright red outboard hanging off the back of it. I dunno. I'm open to suggestions in that department. What would look good?

So, heres what I'm starting with. It currently dosnt run but there isnt a single reason it shouldnt so I'll begin fixing her up in the next few days and I'll update my progress here.


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## BassBlaster

This is the current state of the ignition system. A guy on another forum that rebuilds these old things confirmed these are all original parts and says it was very common for the coils to be in that condition. I ordered lots of new parts that should be here before the weekend. New coils, condensors, points, plugs, plug wires, card rebuild kit with updated plastic float and a water pump rebuild kit. Hopefully that should be all I need to get her going. I did notice a wee bit of oil on the lower unit today so I may be ordering a lower unit seal kit and rebuilding that as well. Hopefully the next update will be a video of her running!!


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## lckstckn2smknbrls

OMG thats pretty.


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## jellio5

Just an FYI for future reference you can also get all the parts for these threw Napa usually much cheaper than an outboard dealer. I did my 1958 last year and the coils on those motors usually are always junk. I would suggest to change the impeller and make sure when you change the impeller you replace the oring on the shaft or you'll get water in the lower unit. Also make sure you check over the orings/gaskets on the tank if there bad it will lose pressure and cause you a bunch of headache's. 

Not to high jack your thread but here's my resto.


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## Bobg

Beautiful machine you've got there. Was there a gas tank with it?


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## BassBlaster

Your restore looks good!! I went to NAPA. They sell Sierra parts. The same Sierra parts were considerably cheaper on iboats even with the cost of shipping and would have taken the same amount of time to get here. I got a complete water pump rebuild kit coming nit just the impellpr. Its everything but the housing. I didnt get new o rings for the fuel connections. If they are bad I'm just gonna order a complete tank repair kit.


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## BassBlaster

Yes Bob, it came with a tank thats in good shape as well. It pumps up and holds pressure. I need to replace the old lines on it. I saw these tanks selling on Ebay in worse condition for 150 to 200 bucks.


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## BassBlaster

All my parts came today except the carb float. I got the ignition system rebuilt and got the water pump rebuilt. As soon as I locate a torque wrench so I can torque the flywhel nut, I'll try and get her started. I'm still gonna rebuild the carb though.

Heres the new ignition system. Looks much better than the old stuff!!


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## Brine

Awesome looking motor. Looks like you know your way around it too. Looking forward to seeing some action footage of this one.


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## Pappy

Points set at .020? You should just barely feel any drag with the feeler ga. and you should never see the points arm move at all when inserting or removing the feeler ga.


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## BassBlaster

Yeppers, got em set. I got it all back together. Rebuilt the water pump and changed the lower unit oil. Put some fresh gas and oil in the tank. I dont know when this thing was last running or even started for that matter. She fired right up on the third pull!! Runs beautifully at idle, just as smooth as can be. Higher rpm's are a little rough and it feels like I should have a lot more throttle. Gonna rebuild the carb this weekend and see what happens.

Heres a video of her running though...

https://s964.photobucket.com/albums/ae127/BassBlaster29/?action=view&current=M2U00016.mp4


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## BassBlaster

I have some oil oozing out of this hole on the side. (see pic) Should it be coming from there and if not how do I correct it?


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## Pappy

That is fine for a little bit of stuff to come out of there. that is pretty much open to exhaust. When the engine was running rough it was probably a little rich and you will get stuff coming out of the engine for the next day or so.


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## BassBlaster

Brine said:


> Awesome looking motor. Looks like you know your way around it too. Looking forward to seeing some action footage of this one.


Not really, just spent alot of time reading manuals and reading threads at iboats. I'm learning though. This one seems pretty straight forward to work on though.


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## cajuncook1

Very nice fine.....I'm jealous!!!

Please use fuel to oil ratio of 24:1 Please Please don't let someone talk you into using something leaner. They will say with today's oil that are superior that you can go leaner.

Today's oils are superior, but use the original factory suggested ratio of 24:1. It will insure longevity of your motor and you can also use synthetic oil TWC-3 2cycle oil. It cuts down on smoke and it is biodegradable.

Congrats on such a fine motor!!!


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## BassBlaster

Thanks!!

I do plan on running it at 24:1. I didnt realize how much oil that was untill I went to get some gas today. 6oz of oil per gallon sure adds up. I'm gonna have to buy this stuff by the gallon!!


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## flintcreek

Looking good.... :mrgreen: 

Flintcreek


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## Bobg

If you need some specifics for that motor, I do have an original Johnson manual that covers all motors from the beginning in the 20's to 1968.

Original list price 321.00
bore 2 3/8
stroke 1 7/8
rpm's 4000
spark plugs j6-j
piston disp 16.60
weight 70 1/2 lbs

As listed in this manual


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## Ictalurus

Dude, awesome motor =D> =D> =D>


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## BassBlaster

Thanks for that info Bob, I was searching for the weight and couldnt find it. I kept seeing "around 65 pounds" but wanted to know for sure. Thanks!!


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## RBuffordTJ

What a beautiful motor...in a manly kind of way of course!

Great find man!


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## BassBlaster

Okay Pappy, I need some of your expertise!!

I cleaned and rebuilt the carb. Put it all back together and put it in a tank to tune it with the cowl off. I got it all tuned up and was running like a brand new one. Ran perfect. Nice and smooth at low and high speeds and a very snappy throttle. I put the cowl back on and obviously the carb gets less air then so I knew I would have to do a little tweaking. The slow speed actually got even smoother!! The high speed side, well, thats another story. I had to turn the needle in about an 1/8th to a 1/4 turn to get it to run smooth at the high speed side but I have lost alot of the rpm's I had with the cowl off and the throttle respnse went to crap. I have to barely ease into the throttle to keep from killing it. What do I need to do?


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## Pappy

You may have to richen the idle to wet the intake system down a little. That will help accelerate the engine. My low speed adjustments usually fall under one full turn from closed. My HS adjustments typically fall around the 1/2-3/4 turn open from the closed off position. As the engine warms if you want your adjustments dead on you may have to change them a little. You will also notice that if you are really close on your idle adjustment when warm that the engine will sneeze after coming back from a good hard run until the crankcase wets down again. That's when you know you are really close! I usually get lazy at that point and richen everything up unless I am at a meet and want the engine's running qualities to really shine! HS speed you want the engine to peak out RPMwise and then richen the mixture around 1/8 turn to cool the pistons a little and give the engine a little cushion. That engine should pull plenty of air with the cowl closed. Try it tomorrow (I know you will !!)and let us know. Will be out in the lake tomorrow afternoon with my old 18hp on the Gheenoe for a while.


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## BassBlaster

Okay thanks. I'll give that a shot tomorrow and see what happens. I did have it sneeze a couple times at idle after coming down from WOT. Thanks for the quick responce!!


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## BassBlaster

That was the ticket Pappy!!

I decarbed the engine today and got lots of black gunk out of it. I also replaced the plugs. I had still been running the old set because I knew I was gonna do the decarb and was gonna burn a set up. The slow speed setting wound up being about 1 3/4 turns out and the high speed somewhere between 1/2 and 3/4 turns out. She's running beautifully from just barely idleing to WOT. Nice snappy throttle and just as smooth as can be all the way through!!. I still feel like I should have a few more rpm's but other than that she's runnin good.

Thanks for all your help.

I'll post a video of it running in a little bit.


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## BassBlaster

Heres the youtube video I made of it this afternoon. I still need to replace the old stock fuel lines and add an in line filter under the hood. I also need to replace the o-rings in the fuel connecter from the tank and the gasket on top of the tank. It leaks just the slightest little bit when the tank is under pressure. But heres the motor running awful dang good for being 55 years old!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RiB5BoPyPbk


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## Bobg

That sure is a sweet running motor.

A few years back I was still able to find rebuild kits for those pressurized tanks.
You should have a stone filter in your fuel bowl.

I see you're in Grove City Oh. I spent some summers there as a kid, staying with an Aunt and Uncle. This was in the 50's.


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## Pappy

Those engines were never made to turn many RPMs, the trade off was an almost perfect idle and lots of bottom end torque. I believe 4500 is the max for that engine.


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## BassBlaster

Bobg said:


> That sure is a sweet running motor.
> 
> A few years back I was still able to find rebuild kits for those pressurized tanks.
> You should have a stone filter in your fuel bowl.
> 
> I see you're in Grove City Oh. I spent some summers there as a kid, staying with an Aunt and Uncle. This was in the 50's.




The rebuild kits are still available. I have seen them on ebay. I was gonna order one and rebuild mine but it works good so no need. It does leak a little when under pressure so I ned to order some o rings for the connector and a new gasket for the top before it goes on the boat.

The carb does have a stone filter. I couldnt get it out when I rebuilt the carb. I didnt fiddle with it to much cause I didnt wanna break it. Just cleaned it up real good and left it alone.


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## BassBlaster

Pappy said:


> Those engines were never made to turn many RPMs, the trade off was an almost perfect idle and lots of bottom end torque. I believe 4500 is the max for that engine.


 I read 4000 some where. Cant remember where.

It sure runs good. I can get the idle down to where I cant even believe its still running. Its so smooth through its entire range. Ive watched other videos of similar motors and they shake like mad while they are running. Not this one. I definately picked a winner!! I think she will offer many years of service. Can't wait to try her out on the lake!!

Now to find a matching 7.5 and maybe an 18 for when I'm not fishing the restricted lakes!!


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## Pappy

Make sure you run the 7 1/2 before purchasing. Those little ones had a slip clutch incorporated into the driveshaft that were prone to failure after hitting a couple submerged objects. After failure they would expand and force the driveshaft up into the crank and load the engine. Also prone to spitting rods ocassionally. That engine I would run on 16 or 20:1. Look for a 5 1/2 instead as they were and are bulletproof. The 3s are incredible running engines as well! Think I have 5 of those at the moment.


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## BassBlaster

Thanks for the tips. I doubt I would ever use those little motors. I just think they would be fun to tinker around on. As excited as I am that this one is finished and runs so good, I'm kinda bummed that I really have no reason to be tinkering on it any more. I replaced the fuel lines today and she's all finished up. An 18hp though would get some use on all the unrestricted lakes around!!


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## Bobg

I read 4000 some where. Cant remember where.

Check back on the specs I posted for your engine.


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## BassBlaster

Bobg said:


> I read 4000 some where. Cant remember where.
> 
> Check back on the specs I posted for your engine.


Oh yeah. See, I knew I read that somewhere, lol. Thanks again.


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## Alumacraft

Im not selling it, but I found a 10 hp from the 50's for cheap.. Wisconsin

https://appleton.craigslist.org/boa/2316444758.html


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## gouran01

Man, that motor is the best $50 i ever spent! I had some issues gettin an initial start with the carbs and such but once she fired the 1st time, it's flawless now! Put er in the river today and was idling great. Mine didn't look near as good as yours, faded way more and a few broken peices of hardeware so I didn't go original but the camo was on my mind too, maybe 1 day?


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## sparty56

Hey Bassblaster: Just bought the same motor, but not original paint. Looking for any tips you might give me in geting this running well. I can get it started, but would like to decarb, change plugs and whatever else I should do. My first motor so don't know a lot about what I am doing. What kind of a manual (owners/repair) would be best to own? Any idea where you can get this?


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## BassBlaster

Sorry Sparty, just saw your post. I havnt spent a lot of time working on outboards, in fact, this was the first one I ever spent any time working on. Best advise I can give ya is to buy a manual, there are several available for this motor. I actually downloaded mine for free on the net. Also ask alot of questions on forums. The best advise and help I got came from this site and at the iboats forum. Nice thng is these motors are everywhere and have been around so long, there are no shortage of people that know everything about them. If your mechanically inclined at all, they are very easy to work on. Still wouldnt go at it without a manual or without someones knowlege but it was really a piece of cake!!


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## bpoulin

Where did you get your manual online? I just bought the same motor with a white rattle can paint job lol. $50 running, You can't go wrong at that price.


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## Spook

Ditto on the manual , I just picked up a 59 18hp myself. She's red and white like yours also man I love the way these old motors look .


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## BassBlaster

Cant remember where I got them. I actually have 2 or 3. Jim sent me one and then I found some others just doing google searches. If you guys PM me your email, I'll try to email them to you. Not makeing any promises but I'll try, lol. The one Jim sent me requires you to download another program to open it. Not a big deal and its the best of the ones I have.


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## Spook

sent ya a pm BB , thanks buddy


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## BassBlaster

K, I have to figure out how to do it. I'll try this evening. I should be able to figure it out, lol.


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## BassBlaster

So I took my little boat out today and had some issues that forced me to fire up my outboard on an elctric only lake. I posted that experience in my boat thread if your interested. Anyhow, when I replaced the water pump, I didnt replace the seals on the lower unit because at the time I couldnt find any. I dont know if that has anything to do with it or not but after running the engine today, I have oil oozing out of a small weep hole on the lower unit. I dont know if this is normal or not but I sure wouldnt think so because quite a bit of oil came out. Because of this, Id like to tear the lower unit apart and just replace all the seals. Problem is no place lists a seal kit for this motor. Anyone know where to get one? Its a 56 QD-17. Thanks!!


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## BassBlaster

Okay, I located and ordered a seal kit from vintage outboard. I still need to find the sealer. Its a 3M product. I have the numbers but cant remember off hand. 847 maybe? Anyhow, is this something that needs to be ordered as well or can I pick it up at an auto parts store or use something equivalent?

I also will need some help with the teardown of this lower unit. I have never had a lower unit apart before. I have a couple of manuals that I downloaded but they only have a few pics and tips, not really teardown instructions which is what I would like. If someone has something with this teardown that they could email me that would be awesome, otherwise a link to something I could buy would work too. Thanks!!


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## cajuncook1

The oily oozing you see coming out of the weep hole is normal. It should smell like a mixture of gas, oil and water. The gear case oil has a different smell.

To check if your gearcase is leaking oil or water is intruding in the gear case through seals, you just drain the lower unit oil and see if there is apparent water or a coffee cream to whitish oil draining out.

If there is neither then your seals are intact and indeed the drainage you see coming out is unused fuel mix and water draining out as it should.

Will check back tomorrow.

Cheers


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## BassBlaster

Ill have to go out tomorrow after work and double check but it seems like this weep hole was down on or near the gear case. I'll pull the plug after work and see what the oil looks like.


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## BassBlaster

Okay, so I double checked everything. The hole the stuff is oozing out of is on the gearcase so it wouldnt seem to me it would be unburned oil/gas but Im fairly new to outbards and very new to these old ones.

This is normal?




The oil looked good to me...







So, everything looks okay to you guys? Ive allready ordered the seal kit. Do I go ahead and replace everything or put them on the shelf untill needed. The seals in there are 57 years old but Ive always been an "if it aint broke dont fix it" kind of guy. What say you?


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## cajuncook1

https://www.tinboats.net/forum/download/file.php?id=51429&mode=view/DSC01793.JPG

The weeps hole are usually at the bottom base of the gear case to the exhaust housing halves. Under the location of the water pump and near the base of the cavitation plate. 

The hole in this picture is not a weep hole. I have a 1955 15hp Evinrude and 1954 10hp Johnson and they both have that hole. It is blind hole and nothing should come out of there. Why it is there, I am uncertain. Maybe some manufacturing casting hole? 

I would take some pipe cleaners and remove the oil out of that hole. It is a little deep, so some of the drained unburnt fuel oil mixture could have pooled in there and after you wipe up and then drained. Making it appeared to drained from there.

***Now after you have cleaned up that hole with a pipe cleaner and get all the oil stuff out and you leave it alone and you see it draining from there in a day or two, then you have a problem.

Otherwise, if your lower unit does not have apparent water or milky or latte colored oil then you should be good.

- Make sure you have new plastic or fiber washer (part number 0311598 washer) behind the upper and lower fill drain screw. Water intrusion into the gear case can come from missing, cracked, or accidental double up washers under the upper and lower fill drain screws.) Please stay away from the Phillips head screw at the base of the lower unit. You don't want to create headache for yourself.
-- I agree, if the gear case is not leaking then don't create a problem. You would need a special tool to remove the shift shaft seal and would have to remove the drive shaft seal as well and seal the gear case halves.
--- Check your lower unit gear oil quality for the next couple of runs, if your satisfied there is not leak, then change at the end of each boating season.

If you indeed have to reseal the lower unit. Then post back or pm back and I'll hook up with videos and information to keep you busy and smiling.


*** Definitely hold onto the reseal kit. Always good to have on hand***

Cheers.


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## BassBlaster

Thanks so much. Ill get that all cleaned up this evening. Ill shoot some brake cleaner and compressed air in there to be sure I got everything out and refill with new oil. Ill report back. Thanks again!!


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## cajuncook1

The break cleaner may your damage your paint. The paint withstands oil, gas, and lube, but certain degreasers, engine cleaners or brake cleaner solution with dissolve your paint. :shock: :shock: 

For whatever reason, the old engines paints don't mind WD40. It will dissolve and clean it out the old and goo and you then blow it out with compressed air. WD40 is great for cleaning away stubborn caked on dirt oil mixed spots. WD40 will also leave a nice protection.

Good luck with fishing!!


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## BassBlaster

Thanks for the tip. No brake cleaner!!


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## BassBlaster

I got that little hole all cleaned out and got the gear case refilled with fresh lube tonight. Will probably be the weekend before I can get out and run it and see what it does. I wanted to see how far that hole went so I found a zip tie that fit. I shoved it in there 4" and never hit bottom. Is this hole really that deep or is mine broke? I coundnt find anything else to fit in there that was flexable to find the actual depth. Plus side, is the zip tie came out clean so i never got into any oil. Hopefully I dont have issues.

Edit: I went back out to try and get something else in it and nothing else will go much further that about 1/2". Shot a flash light up in there and thats all the deeper it is but in the very back there is a groove all the way around the hole that lets a flat object like a zip tie through. Guess theres nothing else to do but run it and see what happens. Thanks for all the help!


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## cajuncook1

That is very odd :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: 

Going to have do some thinking and consults some buddies that are certified experts on this motor.

Will get back with you when ever I find some information regarding this matter.


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## BassBlaster

Awesome. Thanks!!


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## cajuncook1

The gentleman that I got this information from is certified marine mechanic and has worked on the 1950's 60's 70's and 80's motors all his life. He is also a very respected forum member of AOMCI.org and Iboats.com. So, very solid information.



> That is a drain hole and it is supposed to be open. It drains a cavity in the gearcase that would otherwise hold water and maybe freeze. But more often than not, they usually are plugged with sand and crud.
> 
> People usually worry about the oil/water emulsion that comes of of there. It is oil that has gone through the engine and done its job, then expelled out the exhaust. Tell him to stop worrying so much.




The reason my drain holes on the 1955 15hp and 1954 10hp do not allow any drainage is because they hard plugged up with sand and crud. So, I learned something new today!! Now, I need to go and clean those drain hole in my 2 outboard mentioned above.... :LOL2: :LOL2: :LOL2: :LOL2: 

Have fun on the water!! 8)


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## BassBlaster

Thank you so much!! Theres very few places online where people go out of thier way to help someone else. Im so relieved that theres nothing wrong with my motor and so grateful for sites like TB with awsome members. Thanks again and tell your buddy I said thanks!!


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## dkonrai

yes very sweet running motor. the condition is amazing! the 56's have the cool medallion on the sides. 

i have a 5.5 same year, a really nice 54 10 hp and a ok running 54 7.5. added a 46 johnson td20 5hp , that i messed up the paint using some carb cleaner. i almost cried.

the little johnson
[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cVZNjHhJGfI[/youtube]

the 10 hp
[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uZsjDxnjWQU[/youtube]





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dont know if the link came through

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cVZNjHhJGfI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uZsjDxnjWQU

as for the reseal, its not that hard. the worst part is cleaning everything. you will need to buy a cheap gear/seal puller and i used a long spade bit to drift out the shift bushing. bought my seal kit from vintage outboards? i think. to seal the halfs, i just use permatex black or grey seems to work fine. 
dino


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## BassBlaster

So i spent a few hours on the lake today. Spent at least an hour just running this motor. This thing runs so good!! It pushes my fat butt and my modded 1436 at 16mph accoding to my GPS. It never did get on plane though. I think a little more weight in the front or just a little less in the rear could do the trick. I had a full fuel tank today so that didnt help. Still, 16mph is about all I expected anyhow so if it gets on plane and picks up another 1 or 2 mph, that would just be a bonus.

Anyhow, my point of this post is that I didnt get any oil, gas, water, sludge, goo, etc out of any of those holes today. I think I figured out what caused it last weekend and induced the panic about the lower unit. I had left my cap loose and the tank wasnt holding pressure so it kept stalling the motor. Id pump up the tank, choke the motor and fire it back up. I think from all the pumping and choking I was doing, I forced that oil down there and thats why it came out. Just my theory. Anyhow, shes running great now. Fires up on the first pull and just sings all the way across the lake!!

I do have a question about the tank though. It wont hold pressure when the motor isnt running. I can pump it up and run forever and it does just fine. When I stop and fish for awhile, I have to pump the tank up again to get the motor to fire. Is this common? I think I may be losing pressure through the gasket on the cap. 2 years ago, I replaced several gaskets on the tank because it had a leak and I thought I replaced the one on the cap but it looks rough for being new so I may not have replaced that one. Anyhow, its no big deal to pump it up before fireing but I may go ahead and order a new rubber gasket for the cap.

Thanks again to all of those that have helped with this project!!

Oh, I took a video of it running across the lake today with my phone but the file is too big to upload. Anyone know how to get it from my phone to the puter?


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## The Wirtzer

I just picked up one of these from a friend. Its been sitting in his grampa's basement for probably 30 years. Looked online and will be ordering the parts to redo the ignition system and carb. If you are still willing to email me a manual, I'd be grateful. 

One question - and, yes, I'm a noob when it comes to boat motors - what is 'decarb-ing' and how do you do it? 

Thanks in Advance.

Tim


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## BassBlaster

Decarbing is just cleaning all the old built up gunk from inside the engine. It is done by pouring an entire can of SeaFoam into a couple gallons of gas/oil mix and running the entire mixture through the motor at WOT. I did this before changing the plugs as it fouls the plugs up pretty good.Some people will tell you not to do this with these old motors so use your own discretion. I did it because I didnt know any better and was told too. I didnt damage my motor in any way and I got lots of black crud out of it. It is said to really increase compression on a motor that has low compression also.


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## The Wirtzer

Thanks for the reply. 

Tim


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## jd421

Hi Bassblaster,

What kind of phone do you have? What kind of PC do you have? If you know what the file type is, that would help greatly. The file type is indicated by the last three letters after the . in the file name.

Could you post a closeup of the front of your 10hp. Its beautiful!

Does anyone know what that little square thing is that sticks out the left side of the engine, towards the front. (left side as you look at the front.)


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## yotebuster21

Bassblaster,
Would you mind emailing those manuals to me? I just bought a 14' Lowe boat with that exact motor (a lot more rough looking) on it with an motor stand, portable live well, trolling motor, fishfinder, an old mercury 20hp motor, and a trailer for $300. I am going to rebuild the motor and put a custom paint job on it. Any info you can provide would be great. Thanks.


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