# Electrical nightmare



## nvmycj (Jul 2, 2019)

Guys,...
I don't know what to do. Sorry if this sounds very discombobulated! You should see my garage. 

I'm trying to figure out if I need to use both this toggle panel with the fuse block? I won't be pulling a lot of amps, because all I'm wiring up are LED lights, nav lights, and a LED light bar for the bow. 

Plan #1, can I simply wire the battery directly to the toggle panel, and then wire my accessories to it? Or plan #2,...do I NEED to wire by battery to the fuse block with the individual fuses slots, then wire to the toggle panel, then wire to accessories, and then back?

Either way, what gauge of wiring would I need from by battery to the toggle panel for plan#1 or to the fuse block in plan #2? 

Thanks so much!


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## LDUBS (Jul 2, 2019)

I probably know just enough about this to get into trouble. 

You definitely want circuit protection. That fuse block is a really nice unit. My set up also has a master fuse back at the battery. New Wire Marine has a step by step guide to boat wiring basics. It will probably include components not applicable to you but is useful to see how to set things up. If interested, go to their web site, click on the "Resources" tab then on "Boat Wiring Basics". 

Size of wire will depend on length of circuit and load. Below is a link to a really handy chart that TB member Rich99 shared some time ago. Don't forget to read the "fine print". The length is measured as a round trip. So, if you are 6' from the battery, the length is 12'. 


https://www.westmarine.com/WestAdvisor/Marine-Wire-Size-And-Ampacity


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## DaleH (Jul 2, 2019)

For LEDs, you could add simple inline glass fuses after the switches & power that complete helm from the main run from the battery. I would still add circuit protection on that main run to that panel, as it protect the wiring from burning, whereas many people falsely believe that the fuse, breaker or circuit protection is actually protecting the device. Let’s just say ... not really.

Tell you what, I just completed a few wiring jobs for other people and I have a TON of marine wiring and connections left over. If you measured everything out EXACTLY, I could make the wiring up for you custom. PM me if interested.


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## LDUBS (Jul 2, 2019)

Hiya DaleH, 

So, the fuses protecting individual circuits go after the switch -- like: Battery => Main Fuse => Switch Panel => Fuse => LED lights. 

Thanks.

Sorry if I'm causing this thread to drift.


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## CedarRiverScooter (Jul 3, 2019)

Check the USCG boat builder's code. You can easily find it online. IIRC it says to have a main fuse, sized per the wire size, located a few feet from the battery.


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## onthewater102 (Jul 3, 2019)

Continuing from cedar's post every time you distribute the power to a different group of wires you would need a new fuse sized appropriately for the wire you're using. The distribution block serves this purpose, taking the heavier incoming wire from the battery and then fusing the source of all the different power feeds coming out of it with lower current capacities based on the wire types you would connect to it.


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## LDUBS (Jul 3, 2019)

onthewater102 said:


> Continuing from cedar's post every time you distribute the power to a different group of wires you would need a new fuse sized appropriately for the wire you're using. The distribution block serves this purpose, taking the heavier incoming wire from the battery and then fusing the source of all the different power feeds coming out of it with lower current capacities based on the wire types you would connect to it.



Thanks OTW. I got that part. My follow up question is on a switched circuit does the new fuse you mention go before or after the switch? I think it is after but just wanted to confirm.


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## onthewater102 (Jul 3, 2019)

Preferably before - you want it as close to the step down to the new wire diameter as possible, same logic as putting the main fuse block as close to the battery as possible. As Dale said, it protects the wire from burning, so to do so you want it as far upstream on the circuit as you can place it.


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## nvmycj (Jul 3, 2019)

Guys,....

THANKS SO MUCH for all of your advice. 

So in summary,...how does this sound?

Starting from the (+) battery terminal with 6 gauge wire, connect (+) terminal to (+) side of fuse block. From (+) access on fuse block, take appropriate size wire and fuse, attach it to toggle switch. From toggle switch, connect to (+) end of accessory. Then bring (-) from accessory to fuse block. And complete the circuit from (-) end of fuse block to (-) battery terminal with 6 gauge wire. 

Does my VERY crude diagram pic make sense?

Thanks again!


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## DaleH (Jul 3, 2019)

Sounds like OVERKILL ... now I like overhead, but again, how long (1-way) is YOUR longest run?

FYI:
The ABYC ampacity of a 22' circuit (11' run) of #8 AWG = 26 amps at 3% loss

The ABYC ampacity of 22' circuit (11' run) of #8 AWG = 80 amps at 10% loss

You say you're only running LED lights, which are measured in milliamps ... so do you really think you need #6? Not knowing your run, I'd think #10 would do it (30 amps @ 15' run @ 10% loss). I got a ton of #10 ... 

You should also add up the total amps of everything you're powering. If in watts, divide watts by nominal DC voltage of 12.6 to get the amps, i.e., 60-watt spotlight pulls (60 / 12.6) = 4.7 amps, so fuse at 5 amps (or 7 amp if any 'peak pulling power', which is doubtful (usually much higher things like OB starters and electric motors, e.g., hydraulic pumps, bow thruster motors et al).


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## LDUBS (Jul 3, 2019)

onthewater102 said:


> Preferably before - you want it as close to the step down to the new wire diameter as possible, same logic as putting the main fuse block as close to the battery as possible. As Dale said, it protects the wire from burning, so to do so you want it as far upstream on the circuit as you can place it.



Thanks OTW. That is the answer I was hoping for.


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## gnappi (Jul 8, 2019)

If the OP is just talking only LED lights, no bilge pump, horn, radio or any other higher current drain stuff,then a 5A is overkill for most LED's like running lights. 

OP, if you can return that panel, this 6 gang model (available on Feebay) will simplify your issue, and the circuit breakers (IIRC they're 10A) can be changed for lower or higher current if needed. 

https://ibb.co/hHSpygw


Main wire to the fuse panel I'd use 10ga OFC wire, and out to everything else, 12Ga, it will easily handle 80 watt light bars, again OFC. Avoid CCA wire if you can.


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## DaleH (Jul 8, 2019)

12AWG out to LEDs is WAY overkill & expen$ive ...


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## gnappi (Jul 8, 2019)

I don't think a roll of good 12 ga. wire is expensive or out of line, and in OFC it's more readily available than thinner. I pulled 12 because I wanted a bit of freedom to change / add stuff, the OP is free to use 18 gauge


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## GYPSY400 (Jul 10, 2019)

nvmycj said:


> Guys,....
> 
> THANKS SO MUCH for all of your advice.
> 
> ...



Yes this is correct.. this way the entire circuit is protected (especially the switch) .. for wire size, 14 or 16ga is fine for the individual circuits.. the main " feed " can be done with 10ga and protected with a 20 amp fuse.


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## nvmycj (Jul 11, 2019)

GYPSY400 said:


> nvmycj said:
> 
> 
> > Guys,....
> ...



Thank you guys!!


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