# Etec vs Yamaha vs Mercury



## MrGiggles (Jul 19, 2018)

I'm looking at buying a new boat within the next few months and am considering options for motors.

The boat will be a 16' deep V tiller, with 25-40hp.

I'm considering G3, Alumacraft, and Tracker primarily.

G3 offers Yamaha exclusively, and Trackers only come with Mercury. Alumacraft's website shows Honda, Yamaha, Evinrude, and Mercury, but the local dealer only seems to sell Evinrude.

I only have experience with an older 2 stroke Mercury, and am not a fan of them as a whole. The 4 strokes seem noisier than the rest, but I haven't spent much time with them. Any input from Mercury owners is appreciated.

The Etecs seem to be the front runner when it comes to weight and performance, but the direct injection system has me a little worried about long term reliability and serviceability.

Yamaha seems smooth, quiet, and reliable, but heavy. 

Any input on the best choice?


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## ppine (Jul 19, 2018)

The more you read about 4 stroke outboards the more you will hear about Yamaha. 
They show up around the world, everywhere. Many are diesels outside the US. 
I have a 115 hp and it is the best engine I have ever had except for my Ford 7.3 diesel.


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## Weldorthemagnificent (Jul 19, 2018)

There are some interesting etec vs Yamaha videos on YouTube. A lot of etecs where I fish and you can hardly hear them go by. Reliability wise I think all 3 are good choices. As far as longevity, remember the direct injection is an electronic component, as far as the two stroke engine, it has way less moving parts than a 4 stroke. Small Mercs are Tohatsu and have a good reputation as well. Any of them used properly and serviced, should make a great gift to your grandchildren. Next week I am taking my 1983 35hp jonnyrude on an interior camping/fishing trip where I am confident it will get us in and out. Just saying 


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## DaleH (Jul 19, 2018)

Latest pure power & torque tests has the Etec 150hp beating a Yummieha 200hp.


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## bcbouy (Jul 19, 2018)

as i posted a couple weeks back,brp(owns evinrude) purchased alumacraft.if you're in the market for new i imagine they will be packaged as an alumacraft/e tec combo very soon.my last boat was a g3 with a yamaha 15 4 stroke.didn't care for the yamaha carb combo so i swapped for a tohatsu efi.only maker with a short shaft/power tilt/trim 25 horse.my current combo is an alumacraft escape 145 console with an etec 40.man,i could not be happier.way nicer than the lund,princecraft or mirrocraft in terms of console setup,storage,width,engine hp limits.and it moves at around 30 mph at wot with a 13.25x 15 prop.you'll be surprised when you compare engine warranties and incentives as well. etec has a no service for 300 hours or 3 years,no break in and a 10 year warranty. nobody else comes remotely close to that.it also has the highest amp output which is great if you want to run a 2 bank alternator charger.


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## jethro (Jul 20, 2018)

I can give you some insight on Etecs as I have owned a half dozen of them- only in snowmobile motor format. They are proven and reliable. My 800 Etec is the best, most powerful, lightest and most reliable motor package I have ever owned in a sled. I have 8500 miles on my current 2013 Ski Doo 800 Etec. It's good on gas too. If I had to list one downfall it would be this... if you tend to be a guy that likes to work on your own equipment (I am), you will find it hard on an Etec. BRP has and continues to do everything in their power to keep owners from being able to put wrenches their equipment. I do all my own service and I bought a fairly expensive software package to do certain things. If you want to clean your reed valves, you need to reset them through the ECU using the Bombardier software. If you lose a key you need to reprogram your ECU to accept the new one which is RFID coded. But if you tend to let the dealer do your maintenance then this is no concern.

One cool feature of the Etecs is the self storage function. Push a button and it will fog itself for storage.

The three boat motors I currently own are all Mercurys. Two smokers and one four stroke. They have been rock solid reliable as well but none are fuel injected.


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## ppine (Jul 20, 2018)

Weldorthemagnificent said:


> There are some interesting etec vs Yamaha videos on YouTube. A lot of etecs where I fish and you can hardly hear them go by. Reliability wise I think all 3 are good choices. As far as longevity, remember the direct injection is an electronic component, as far as the two stroke engine, it has way less moving parts than a 4 stroke. Small Mercs are Tohatsu and have a good reputation as well. Any of them used properly and serviced, should make a great gift to your grandchildren. Next week I am taking my 1983 35hp jonnyrude on an interior camping/fishing trip where I am confident it will get us in and out. Just saying
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Speaking of family heirlooms, yesterday I was working on a 1929 Johnson 1.5 hp motor that has been in the family since 1948. We used it as kids to run a dinghy. When I was 12 years old, I camped with 3 friends on an island in Chesapeake Bay for a week. We did it twice. That was around 1962. Yesterday working on that old Johnson I was 12 years old again right back there on the Bay. That was 56 years ago.


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## Weldorthemagnificent (Jul 20, 2018)

ppine said:


> Weldorthemagnificent said:
> 
> 
> > There are some interesting etec vs Yamaha videos on YouTube. A lot of etecs where I fish and you can hardly hear them go by. Reliability wise I think all 3 are good choices. As far as longevity, remember the direct injection is an electronic component, as far as the two stroke engine, it has way less moving parts than a 4 stroke. Small Mercs are Tohatsu and have a good reputation as well. Any of them used properly and serviced, should make a great gift to your grandchildren. Next week I am taking my 1983 35hp jonnyrude on an interior camping/fishing trip where I am confident it will get us in and out. Just saying
> ...


Great memories. It’s fun to share with the kids. My boys will be using a 1971 Johnson 4hp. 


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## Crazyboat (Jul 20, 2018)

I can't say anything bad about any one product these days, that said go with the one that has the most service near you, or the best service near you.


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## moloch16 (Jul 22, 2018)

Those who make a living on boats use Yamaha. You can never go wrong or have any regrets with Yamaha, so that's what I'd go with if you have a choice.

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## wmk0002 (Jul 23, 2018)

How do prices compare between them all? 

They finally opened a new local 650 acre lake to the public last week that has a 25 hp limit, and at the same time, upped the existing local 10hp restricted lake to 25hp as well. I have been running a 1992 9.9hp (modified to 15hp) Johnson on my 1648 Alumacraft flatbottom but with the new higher hp limits have been looking at new 25hp 4 strokes. I need a short shaft and would like electric start, EFI, and PT&T. My local Tohatsu dealer claims they offer all of those features at $4100 which seems pretty cheap, however, that motor/options comes in a t 180 something lbs. I'd prefer a Yamaha honestly but I figure they will be a good bit more.


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## Weldorthemagnificent (Jul 23, 2018)

Don’t be afraid of the tohatsu. The 20 might be worth a look for you as the motors are grouped 15-20, 25-30. The 20 will be cheaper and lighter and probably not much slower on your boat. Lots of good reviews on them. The likelihood of you doing any major repairs or warranty work on this motor should it be required is low. I would choose the brand carried by a local dealer who you like and has a good reputation over one farther away. 


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## wmk0002 (Jul 23, 2018)

Weldorthemagnificent said:


> Don’t be afraid of the tohatsu. The 20 might be worth a look for you as the motors are grouped 15-20, 25-30. The 20 will be cheaper and lighter and probably not much slower on your boat. Lots of good reviews on them. The likelihood of you doing any major repairs or warranty work on this motor should it be required is low. I would choose the brand carried by a local dealer who you like and has a good reputation over one farther away.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



I'm definitely not afraid of the Tohatsu brand. My concern would be more so wit the dealer. My local dealer with the great prices is Backwoods Landing in Alabama. Pretty popular place, even on this forum, as they are a big time Weldbilt dealer and offer the best prices on those too. I don't have any issues with them but their dealership is a tiny trailer with a small lean to off the side they use as a shop and boat rigging place. Last I heard they just had one Tohatsu mechanic who only worked there a couple days a week. I would have concerns about that. There are other dealers within 1.5 hours of me but I doubt they can beat Backwoods prices.


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## MrGiggles (Jul 23, 2018)

wmk0002 said:


> How do prices compare between them all?
> 
> They finally opened a new local 650 acre lake to the public last week that has a 25 hp limit, and at the same time, upped the existing local 10hp restricted lake to 25hp as well. I have been running a 1992 9.9hp (modified to 15hp) Johnson on my 1648 Alumacraft flatbottom but with the new higher hp limits have been looking at new 25hp 4 strokes. I need a short shaft and would like electric start, EFI, and PT&T. My local Tohatsu dealer claims they offer all of those features at $4100 which seems pretty cheap, however, that motor/options comes in a t 180 something lbs. I'd prefer a Yamaha honestly but I figure they will be a good bit more.



I don't think there is a huge difference in price, but I don't have much to go by.

I have also thought about buying the boat and motor separately, it's not like a tiller motor is hard to setup. I don't know how that is going to work with financing.


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## Brian121804 (Jul 23, 2018)

wmk0002 said:


> How do prices compare between them all?
> 
> They finally opened a new local 650 acre lake to the public last week that has a 25 hp limit, and at the same time, upped the existing local 10hp restricted lake to 25hp as well. I have been running a 1992 9.9hp (modified to 15hp) Johnson on my 1648 Alumacraft flatbottom but with the new higher hp limits have been looking at new 25hp 4 strokes. I need a short shaft and would like electric start, EFI, and PT&T. My local Tohatsu dealer claims they offer all of those features at $4100 which seems pretty cheap, however, that motor/options comes in a t 180 something lbs. I'd prefer a Yamaha honestly but I figure they will be a good bit more.



I paid $3,650.00 for my 2017 Yamaha F25SWHC (short shaft, electric start, tiller handle) last fall, it weighs in at 132 pounds (a major factor for me), unfortunately they don't offer PT&T on the short shaft. I couldn't be more happy with it.

Yamaha just started their summer sales promotion, on a 25 you'll get $300 in dealer credit.


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## bcbouy (Jul 23, 2018)

you will be hard pressed to find a power tilt/trim in anything under a 30 hp short shaft.unless you shell out for an aftermarket cmc or similar.that's why i went with tohatsu 25,it was the only one offering pt/t in a s/s and it was a damn good engine.and any mercury dealer can service it.


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## turbotodd (Jul 24, 2018)

25hp is about all I can speak about.

ETEC 25 is a heavy, expensive pig. "Less moving parts" is a misnomer....the ENGINE itself has fewer moving parts but what they don't tell you is that the high pressure fuel pump, injectors, regulator...those all contain moving parts. Once it's all said and done, you have just as many moving parts as a 4 stroke. A 25 ETEC weighs 166 lbs; at least the one I weighed did. A new Yamaha 25 is 130 (short shaft electric start manual tilt). 30 lb difference there. ETEC requires THEIR oil; if you plan on using anyone else's oil, you've got to have the ECU flashed and then your fuel economy drops a little too (and oil usage goes up....sound familiar? Think Volkswagen....). Runs cleaner? Only if you use THEIR oil on their tune. The ETEC is also expensive to buy...and after the warranty's up, to repair. Best I remember, the ones I was looking at were in the $5500 range (electric start models). Also look at the charging system. 56A total, and 15A dedicated. That means that the electrical system to RUN the engine (injectors, ecu, etc) draws 41 amps. 

Quite a few duck hunters out here bought into the ETEC 25's when they first came out, and initially they absolutely LOVED them. Now that a minute or two has passed, those who still own them don't much care for 'em. The ones who still say they love 'em, are usually die hard 2 stroke lovers and/or Evinrude brand-loyalists--although Evinrude is not the same as it used to be (BRP vs OMC). Some just prefer to own the name I guess.

Take a ride on a stream or lake that has a few rental boats/motors and/or guide boats. You'll see more Yamaha than anything-for lots of reasons.

Tohatsu ain't a bad motor either....I'll give them credit. There are things I don't like about them though, such as the shifting, they're a little louder in the foot area, don't care for the appearance, they're a little heavy...but they run nice being that they're 3 cylinder engines. But there's the weight penalty along with the 3rd cylinder. Mercury, Nissan, and Tohatsu 25hp are all the same exact motor except the paint and decals.


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## wmk0002 (Jul 24, 2018)

Turbotodd, do the new 25hp Yamahas have significant vibration at low speeds? I have read that a couple of places and in a couple of videos on them it appeared like the tiller was vibrating the drivers hand a lot. Not really a huge, deal but obviously would rather have it smooth in all ranges.


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## MrGiggles (Jul 24, 2018)

turbotodd said:


> 25hp is about all I can speak about.
> 
> ETEC 25 is a heavy, expensive pig. "Less moving parts" is a misnomer....the ENGINE itself has fewer moving parts but what they don't tell you is that the high pressure fuel pump, injectors, regulator...those all contain moving parts. Once it's all said and done, you have just as many moving parts as a 4 stroke. A 25 ETEC weighs 166 lbs; at least the one I weighed did. A new Yamaha 25 is 130 (short shaft electric start manual tilt). 30 lb difference there. ETEC requires THEIR oil; if you plan on using anyone else's oil, you've got to have the ECU flashed and then your fuel economy drops a little too (and oil usage goes up....sound familiar? Think Volkswagen....). Runs cleaner? Only if you use THEIR oil on their tune. The ETEC is also expensive to buy...and after the warranty's up, to repair. Best I remember, the ones I was looking at were in the $5500 range (electric start models). Also look at the charging system. 56A total, and 15A dedicated. That means that the electrical system to RUN the engine (injectors, ecu, etc) draws 41 amps.
> 
> ...



Sounds pretty much like the rest of BRP's lineup. Incredible performance at the cost of longevity and serviceability.


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## bcbouy (Jul 24, 2018)

i would take everything turbotod says with a grain of salt.10 year warranty because it's a piece of junk?right.and it's heavier because it has the power tilt/trim.we all know how bad those 40 year old evinrudes are that alot of guys are still running.and we all know the bottom end grunt of the etec sucks too,right? lets not gloss over the almost double power output of them.25 amps dedicated. sounds like sour grapes to me.my last evinrude lasted almost 30 years.post in 30 years and tell us how your yamaha is doing.if you have it flashed to run xp 100 you use almost half the oil as xp 50.i run all day and use maybe 3 liters of fuel,so any difference is marginal at best,and i haven't filled my oil tank since i got it in march,so i call bs.i can tell you right now,for me,my 40 etec burns less fuel and has more power and is smoother running than my 25 tohatsu,and i loved that motor.


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## turbotodd (Aug 2, 2018)

I said nothing about it being a "piece of junk". 

Brand loyal perhaps?

Just pointed out what I personally didn't like about the 25hp ETEC that I have had experience with...and no it didn't have PT&T. Their LIGHTEST 25hp is 162 lbs as advertised. It's a 2 stroke engine. It's SUPPOSED to be lighter, but it's not. It's heavier than most of the modern 4 stroke 25hp models, thus IMO, outdated. It's a 2 stroke and "should" be less complex in it's design. It is...the basic ENGINE is, but we're not considering the numerous systems that are required to run the engine (specifically the fuel system components)-which are actually more complex than modern EFI 4 stroke stuff. On a 4 stroke, you're injecting fuel. On an ETEC, you're injecting fuel at higher pressures and also add oil injection...more complexity, more weight, one more thing to think about (have to add oil once in a while, and it's got to be specific oil in some cases). Speaking of which....I spent the entire weekend on the waterways in this area and didn't see a single ounce of ETEC specific oil...tells me that either they just don't keep it, or there's not too many ETEC's on the water in this area, OR they don't use much oil. Or a combination of one or more. I don't know. The weight turned me away from them. That among other things. One I used was smooth and pretty quiet but not the best looking, and the oil deal turned me away. I know about the re-flash....but with that reflash, is the engine still EPA certified 3 star? AND....price...the ETEC 25hp is what? $5500? Local dealer is discounting them severely ('16 models which are still new in crate) but couldn't tell me the price until I show up & do paperwork. Sounded shady to me but whatever. 

10 year warranty? 3 years standard non-declining is what the warranty statement says. Didn't see anything about 10 years unless you buy extended warranty. Even then, you've got to stick to their service requirements...and document it 100%, if not, there goes your warranty. Might not be a big deal but it can be depending on who the owner is. Similar to Dodge pickups (that I know of...others may be similar)...yeah they've got warranty, but it's only "good" if you stick to the servicing requirements...and on the 2500 diesel, that service is not cheap. Brother's hemi pickup had an engine issue, and because he was "over" by 235 miles on a scheduled oil change, they denied the claim.


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## JL8Jeff (Aug 2, 2018)

My cousin has a 50 Etec on one boat and he loves it even though they did have some issue. They also tried a Yamaha 40 4 stroke on the same boat. He didn't like it nearly as much and they had some issue with that as well. He has a Merc 50 4 stroke on his other boat and it doesn't have the power of the Etec and he had an issue with that motor as well. They sold the Yamaha and it's on someone else's boat and seems to be running fine, I see him on the river all the time. Their Etec and Merc 50's are running fine on their 2 boats. So I don't know if any one of the motors is heads and tails above the others. It probably comes down to the owner wanting a 2 stroke vs 4 stroke or the weight or the cost. My 1994 Merc 60/45 jet seems to be running well and I have no intentions of swapping it out.


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## gatorglenn (Aug 2, 2018)

You should look at Tohotsu motors. All so check out Performance testing of the 40 hp class. On YouTube and you will not buy a Yamaha atfer that.


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## Crazyboat (Aug 4, 2018)

I was replacing a hot water heater one time and my plumber told me to go with the 6 yr rated unit over the 15 yr rated one. Reason being, they are the same exact unit but the 15 yr one you pay for the "warranty" if it craps out early.

I strongly suspect it's the reason why E-Tec is so much more expensive then the other brands, they extended the warranty (for a time, don't know if it is still the case) and the added cost of purchase covers that.

IMO TuboTodd's comments were spot on.

As he also pointed out, the Evinrude of old is nothing of the Evinrude of today, OMC and BRP have nothing but a name in common.


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## bcbouy (Aug 30, 2018)

very true.more reliable,more efficient,lighter,better emissions,more powerful,better warranty and quieter.oh,and direct injected.so much more money?do some research. i can't believe you guys dumped on etecs with a straight face.10 year warranty and no service at all for 300 hours.any other new engine is serviced after the first 30.right after you break it in.whats that cost at your dealer?.etec?thats right,no break in needed.i went wot right out of the box.oil and filters?nope.winterize it,nope,does it itself.yeah,its been a month,but i just got back from my 1 month camp/fish trip.anyway,nuff said.


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## DaleH (Aug 30, 2018)

I don't one can generalize brands, but need to stay focused on ONE hp rating. All I know is that our boat club has a Yam 15hp 4-stroke and it is an absolute HEAVY PIG where the OMC 9.9hps on that SAME frp skiffs out-perform it.


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## handyandy (Aug 30, 2018)

Seems like that todd had a bad experience with a bad dealer. None the less that should play apart of your decision check out your various dealers all the mentioned motors are pretty good they all have pros and cons. A big part of the motor is not only the motor but how well the dealer will take care of you. Unfortunately there are bad dealers out there of every brand I'd say. 

If I were buying new I'd go etec, the small mercs are tohatsu, so your just paying a mercury badge upcharge on a tohatsu in my eyes on that one. Yamaha's are good, but so are the rest I personally think the yamaha's are a little overrated. Back in the two stroke days they were the best. OMC two strokes were of good design but by the 90's they suffered from some poor quality control which yamaha had a big leg up on them. Merc in the 90's was good but they were just getting caught up to omc and yamaha designs, but I'd say had better quality control than omc. Yamaha had the best electronics back in the two stroke hey days of the 90's, good designs/engineering, good quality control I'd say they really got their reputation from their engines in the 90's and into the early 2000's before everyone had to switch to four stroke. OMC had some good designs and engineering but they're quality control really killed them. Now they're all pretty good I'm not saying new yams are bad by at all they're still great engines, but I don't think they have any major leg up over the other major companies now. 

The reason the etec 25 is kind of heavy is because it's the same block and same engine as the 30hp essentially I believe the yam 25hp is the upper power limit of that block/engine which is also the same one from what I can find same displacement as the 20hp. However the yam 30 weighs more than the etec 30. Etec 30 is the same weight as their 25hp, so if you went etec I'd say get the 30 why not have a few more ponies for the same weight. The etecs are quiet fuel efficient and don't use a lot of oil so the oil although is expensive with a little 25 or 30 hp the usage would be quiet low. Still go talk to your dealers and feel them out and try to figure out which you think would be best for you to purchase from. Often times its the dealer that can make break a brand for someone.


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## MrGiggles (Aug 30, 2018)

I ended up buying a cheap project instead of a new one.

It is not exactly what I wanted, but we'll see how I like it. If I don't, I'm in it cheap enough that I could sell it and make some money, along with my old boat, and have a pretty good chunk of change to play with.

Financing probably wouldn't have played out anyway, even though I have a strong score, my average credit history is not that long and I likely wouldn't have been approved.


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