# Flare Guns are signaling devices, legal in all 48 states.



## Flbigguy1950 (Apr 21, 2014)

Back in 2008, a question came up about the legality of a Flare gun. I just purchased a German made Flare Pistol from a Gun Auction website and they had this information listed: NO FFL LICENSE or PERMITS NEEDED TO BUY, OWN, SELL or TRADE THIS FLARE PISTOL. IT CAN LEGALLY FIRE SHOTGUN SHELL BUCKSHOT AMMO MAKING THIS A TRUE "SHOTGUN" PISTOL & SURVIVAL PISTOL TO TAKE CAMPING OR ON BOATING TRIPS. It's like having a single shot Taurus 'JUDGE' pistol that can also fire flares! A flare pistol is a very interesting device. Any person can own and carry concealed a flare pistol without a permit in all the states of the U.S.A. because it is a signaling safety product. I figure they know the law better than I do. Naturally it'd be illegal in Canada so you better have a SPOT device https://www.findmespot.com/en/ in case of trouble.
**********************
An insert can be purchased at additional cost to fire .22 LR, .45 Long Colt/.410 Shotshells or 12 Gauge aerial flares available on other websites. I intend to get a .410 insert and a 12 Gauge insert. One for water moccasins and one for rescue kept in a tackle box of my boat. https://www.gunauction.com/buy/12757311/survival-gear/flare-pistol-26.5mm-steel-german-made-1970 This is legal in Florida but not concealed, a CCW would still be required.


----------



## redbug (Apr 21, 2014)

I fished lake Ontario on the USA side and was under the impression that flare guns are forbidden


----------



## Rat (Apr 21, 2014)

[url=https://www.tinboats.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=349546#p349546 said:


> Flbigguy1950 » Today, 16:18[/url]"]Back in 2008, a question came up about the legality of a Flare gun. I just purchased a German made Flare Pistol from a Gun Auction website and they had this information listed: NO FFL LICENSE or PERMITS NEEDED TO BUY, OWN, SELL or TRADE THIS FLARE PISTOL. IT CAN LEGALLY FIRE SHOTGUN SHELL BUCKSHOT AMMO MAKING THIS A TRUE "SHOTGUN" PISTOL & SURVIVAL PISTOL TO TAKE CAMPING OR ON BOATING TRIPS. It's like having a single shot Taurus 'JUDGE' pistol that can also fire flares! A flare pistol is a very interesting device. Any person can own and carry concealed a flare pistol without a permit in all the states of the U.S.A. because it is a signaling safety product. I figure they know the law better than I do. Naturally it'd be illegal in Canada so you better have a SPOT device https://www.findmespot.com/en/ in case of trouble.
> **********************
> An insert can be purchased at additional cost to fire .22 LR, .45 Long Colt/.410 Shotshells or 12 Gauge aerial flares available on other websites. I intend to get a .410 insert and a 12 Gauge insert. One for water moccasins and one for rescue kept in a tackle box of my boat. https://www.gunauction.com/buy/12757311/survival-gear/flare-pistol-26.5mm-steel-german-made-1970 This is legal in Florida but not concealed, a CCW would still be required.



Make sure you post a video for us when you fire that 12 gauge buckshot round with that pistol... #-o


----------



## earl60446 (Apr 21, 2014)

Just because it is legal to shoot a 12 gauge shotgun round does not mean it is safe to do so.
Tim


----------



## ccm (Apr 22, 2014)

If your going to try and fire buckshot from it I'd do it remotely. Cant think of a worse scenario than it blowing up in your hands causing serious injury or even death.


----------



## Loggerhead Mike (Apr 22, 2014)

I've always wanted one


----------



## JMichael (Apr 22, 2014)

Not only would I not fire that thing with a load of 12 ga buckshot, I wouldn't want to be near anyone that did. Can't imagine the forces on the wrist from that. And I could be wrong but I thought there were federal & state laws about the minimum barrel length (18" from what I remember) for shotguns without special permits or license. And you sure don't want to tell a game warden around here that you've got something for shooting snakes with! That's a huge NO NO around here. :shock: 

If you are modifying the original device with inserts or other methods that allow it to fire modern firearm munitions, I'm not sure it would still come under the "signaling device" umbrella and might be classified as a firearm then. Either way, I'd check with local law enforcement and game and fish personnel before I started hauling it around. This is one case where it may not be easier to get forgiveness than permission.


----------



## Butthead (Apr 22, 2014)

Those Kennesaw Cannon inserts are pretty cool, but I'm sure in some states, like here in MD, it would have to be registered to keep it legal. 
What kind of lame outlaw would you be toting a .22 shooting flare gun! :lol: 

Definitely a bad idea with the plastic flare guns. Check out these pictures: https://www.atf.gov/press/releases/2006/05/050406-openletter-nfa-flare-inserts.html


----------



## SumDumGuy (Apr 22, 2014)

I would have no issue firing that thing with 12 gauge shells. After all, it is steel and German made.


----------



## JMichael (Apr 22, 2014)

Yes, it's steel, and I have no doubt that the Germans did a very good job designing & building it. But it's steel that was designed to handle the forces of a flare, not the forces of modern weapons ammo. I've seen a good quality firearm have a catastrophic failure so there's no way I'd risk my eyesight/fingers to do something with that thing that it wasn't designed to do.


----------



## lovedr79 (Apr 23, 2014)

make sure when you make this youtube video you start with "Hey yall watch this"


----------



## Jim (Apr 23, 2014)

[url=https://www.tinboats.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=349783#p349783 said:


> lovedr79 » 23 Apr 2014 08:25 am[/url]"]make sure when you make this youtube video you start with "Hey yall watch this"


 :LOL2: 

Disclaimer (For all the lawyers): This is not a TinBoats.net endorsed/sponsored exercise.


----------



## BigTerp (Apr 23, 2014)

I think the trick to it is they can legally sell you the flare pistol, no problem. But once you buy and equip the .410, 12 gauge, etc. insert you've made the flare pistol a firearm and it'll be subject to state/federal laws. Not something I'd want to run the risk of getting strung up for.


----------



## Captain Ahab (Apr 23, 2014)

[url=https://www.tinboats.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=349790#p349790 said:


> Jim » Wed Apr 23, 2014 8:04 am[/url]"]
> 
> 
> [url=https://www.tinboats.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=349783#p349783 said:
> ...



It is if we can can BassAddict to do it!


----------



## BassAddict (Apr 23, 2014)

Captain Ahab said:


> [url=https://www.tinboats.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=349790#p349790 said:
> 
> 
> > Jim » Wed Apr 23, 2014 8:04 am[/url]"]
> ...



Why does Ahab mention me in every post? 
I think he has a man crush on me......


----------



## kycolonel138th (Apr 28, 2014)

[-X Not Me :roll:


----------



## rickybobbybend (Apr 29, 2014)

Ah, legal in all "48" states. You must know 2 where they are not legal.


----------



## PSG-1 (May 5, 2014)

I've never had the desire to blow my hand off. Had a close call with improvised 12 ga loads with a Mossberg 500 when I was about 19. I found out hot glue doesn't work so good for making slugs. After hand-grenading that shotgun, and by a miracle, not being maimed or killed, decided to quit with doing dumb crap. It took me about 5 years after that incident before I was brave enough to start reloading ammunition for handguns and rifles, and then another 10 years after that, before I was brave enough to begin loading shotgun shells (on a press this time, though, not using the haphazard BS that I was doing when I blew up that Mossberg)

Shooting actual ammunition from a plastic-frame flare pistol just seems like a bad idea to begin with. Best to stick with flares, and avoid problems with DNR, USCG, and the ATF. Also it will avoid problems such as blown-off fingers, or the shooter and/or bystanders being maimed, blinded, or disfigured.

I will say that I do have a 25mm Orion launcher with the adapter for 12 ga flares, and I have made my own 12 ga 'bird bombs' to shoot from that pistol. A bird bomb is where you cut the shell down, remove the regular gunpowder, use just a few grains of black powder as the lifting charge, then, drill a small hole through the base for the wad, and stick the fuse of an M-80 through this. Then, install the wad with the M-80, fuse down, into the 12 ga shell, and seal off the end with a few drops of wax. When it fires, it will send the M-80 about 75-100 ft into the air with a loud bang. 

But a bird bomb isn't what would be considered "ammunition" as it's not a "projectile".... you can't hunt with it, and it is not lethal. 
Technically, it is a class C firework, or a "sound signaling device" to be more correct.

Let's fire ammunition in firearms that are designed to safely fire it....like, 12 ga buckshot for the shotguns, and the Elmer Keith Magnum Memorial loads for our revolvers.


----------



## Snowshoe (May 11, 2014)

It probably violates Federal Law. I'd call the ATF on it prior to trying it and even if it was legal, no way would I fire it.


----------



## satx78247 (May 11, 2014)

TRUST ME on this: The same federal agency (BATFE) that "determined that" an ordinary shoelace "constitutes an unregistered machinegun", when "possessed a the same time and place, that a person possesses a firearm" WILL determine that a flare gun that is CAPABLE of firing a shotgun/pistol/rifle cartridge, is an unregistered & therefore "prohibited weapon" under federal law. =====> 200.oo "spread out" over a period of several years is a CHEAP "investment".
(The penalty for being convicted of simply POSSESSING a UNREGISTERED "prohibited weapon" is TEN YEARS in the federal pen.)

IF you want to own a "shot pistol" or a "short-barreled weapon made from a shotgun or rifle", the tax (to make or buy a "short-barreled firearm") is only a one-time fee of 200.oo & if you ask politely at the local BATFE office, they will even help you complete the paperwork & get your "NFA firearm" licensed properly.
(Btw, there are any number of shot-pistols that can be registered for a one-time tax of FIVE DOLLARS, as an "any other weapon". = For example, the WITNESS PROTECTION GUN that is a pump-action 12 or 20 gauge handgun, with 10/12/14 inch barrel.)

When I was a city marshal long ago, I had a "licensed" 20 gauge "shot pistol" made from a double-barrel shotgun. - It had 10" barrels & was "ferocious" when loaded with buckshot, at up to about 30M. 
(Btw, just DISPLAYING "my little friend" stopped many an ugly brawl, at any number of beer joints, WITHOUT gunfire/bloodshed as MOST thugs have an idea of what a "sawed-off shotgun" will do.)

Note: I am NOT a lawyer & you should ASK the BATFE for guidance, if you want to own a "shot pistol", a suppressed weapon, a "destructive device" or any other NFA weapon.

just my OPINION, satx
USAMPR, Retired


----------

