# RiverPro LoPro with Extra HD Bottom and 1/2" UHMW



## Darkside (Jan 10, 2012)

My buddy Vince and I took a long weekend road trip from PA to Missouri. We went out to put UHMW/Poly on a pair of RiverPro hulls. Being new to tin-boats, Kevin and I battled over UHMW posts in the past, and this may not sound strange but he's been down this UHMW road before and felt the performance hits by adding poly were too substantial to make it an option he was comfortable with. 

Regardless, he gave me the opportunity to come out when the boat is little more than an empty shell so we can flip it over so I could add the poly was an opportunity I couldn’t turn down. And by the way, I did check the weather when we arrived- _*No hell did not freeze over LOL*_. 

We arrived Thursday morning, had breakfast at the Waffle House and then went over to the shop. After visiting and catching up with Kevin, we nosed around the various bays and work stations and even snuck outside to see what unnamed boat projects (new and old) they had laying around the grounds. That might have been the most interesting part for me. Kevin had us unload our tool boxes and gear (saws, drills, drivers, hardware…) and showed us the work area he had set aside for us. A moment later the guys were breaking for lunch and Vince looked at me… “it’s lunch time already and we haven’t even started yet” how time flies... our time was limited so we went right into work mode.



 



Between Vince and I we had installed UHMW on 5 boats (now 7) and since one was Vince’s 2007 LoPro, we had a real good idea of what we wanted to accomplish. Due to the complex shape of the bottom, the plan was simple – cover the middle (lowest 3’) of the hull and the four turning strakes with 1/2" poly. Kevin’s previous attempts were covering the whole bottom and I think he was interested in our approach and hopeful the performace going this route held. 

They also had a clever way to pre-shape the UHMW to match the delta pad and the deadrise of the hull and we banged our heads together and came up with a great way to match up the front/closed edge of the turning strakes. 

I am not saying that RiverPro will be adding a poly/UHMW option down the road, but the seed is planted. And since I strategically left the paper pattern guide behind when we left – _*IF*_ Kevin wants to consider a one piece application with bolting the UHMW in place or using vacuum + glue process he has a test case that should protect the most vulnerable area of the hull. I can say that while we were installing the UHMW, a few of the RiverPro build techs were watching us and asking questions. There was some give and take and we all learned from it. 

This boat will have the optional ¼” HD Skid Plate that mine has on it now, only it was welded inside rather than outside. It will have ½” UHMW Poly and new ¼” vertical trussed stringer supports (for a lack of a better name) that KT and the guys added. 

Hoping it will fair well when i get it back here to the Delaware and Susquehanna rivers.


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## Jim (Jan 10, 2012)

Awesome! Thanks for the post!

I will own a RiverPro one day for sure.


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## LonLB (Jan 10, 2012)

Darkside said:


> My buddy Vince and I took a long weekend road trip from PA to Missouri. We went out to put UHMW/Poly on a pair of RiverPro hulls. Being new to tin-boats, Kevin and I battled over UHMW posts in the past, and this may not sound strange but he's been down this UHMW road before and felt the performance hits by adding poly were too substantial to make it an option he was comfortable with.
> 
> Regardless, he gave me the opportunity to come out when the boat is little more than an empty shell so we can flip it over so I could add the poly was an opportunity I couldn’t turn down. And by the way, I did check the weather when we arrived- _*No hell did not freeze over LOL*_.
> 
> ...





That looks great, and sounds like a phenomenal idea.
I've worked on enough engineering projects, and spent time with a few very knowledgeable guys to know how this will likely play out though.

They LOVE the idea. They want to do it, BAD. But, money and manufacturing is the deciding factor.

It's hard to get anyone, upper management or production to buy into something that will either cost more, or take longer/be harder to build.


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## blw (Jan 10, 2012)

Darkside, Please keep us posted !! I have a 186 LOPRO as well. We have some pretty rough rivers in Georgia too. I would love to add it to my hull. Thanks, BLW


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## bassboy1 (Jan 10, 2012)

Given how a couple of the Riverpro boats here on the Etowah look (ie: number or repairs and patches), I'd say putting the UHMW on is a wise choice. 

While I do think that the Riverpro boats are excellent for what they are, on this particular river, flat out durability is much more important than the speed and agility, where the Riverpro shines (and it is a valuable asset on many rivers - just not this one). I'd personally want the UHMW to run the Etowah, even if it did come at a 20 mph loss in speed.


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## Darkside (Jan 11, 2012)

Bassboy- The LoPro we put UHMW on in 2007 lost 2 mph on it's top speed after we added the poly. It was done nearly exactly the same. 

We did notice that it sat-down quicker coming off plane (i.e. not as smooth a transition) and that it felt like it came on step differently. I didn't notice anything in sharp hook turns and maybe someone like Kevin would, the performance loss was maybe 4-5%.

In the course of a year I make about 90-100 river launches in my jet. I try as hard as I can to limit the wear and tear on the boat - At 48 years old - my memory and my eyes are less than at their best LOL. But I doubt at 20 I could have memorized every chute and shallow read because I fish 5 different rivers throughout the year. Example, in 2011 alone, that is 24 different boat ramps in what comes out to memorizing over 300 linear miles of river. Add the ever changing levels in a river and nice hard winters and floods where ice and flow move car sized rocks around the river. 

So for me the UHMW isn't there to pound rocks, it is there to keep me out of the shop or worse when I do make a mis-read or outright mistake. With the UHMW, I get a Do-Over, a mulligan, a chance for the boat to "live another day".

My experience with UHMW (I've owned 3 boats with it from 1999 - 2010). Is if you run it like it has UHMW on it, you'll beat the dog out of the boat over time - rocks will eventually win the battles. If you run it with a little fear or respect for those rock ledges, your boat will last a long-long!


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## bassboy1 (Jan 11, 2012)

Darkside said:


> Bassboy- The LoPro we put UHMW on in 2007 lost 2 mph on it's top speed after we added the poly. It was done nearly exactly the same.
> 
> We did notice that it sat-down quicker coming off plane (i.e. not as smooth a transition) and that it felt like it came on step differently. I didn't notice anything in sharp hook turns and maybe someone like Kevin would, the performance loss was maybe 4-5%.
> 
> ...



Oh, I completely agree. I'm glad to hear that you are only losing a couple mph. I was pointing out that even if the loss was as great as 20 mph, I'd still rather have it, and for the reasons that you do. In this river, you aren't slamming rocks all day long, but it does have a tendency to reach out and 'bite' you with something that shouldn't be where it is. Some of those aren't rocks, they are chunks of pig iron that were dumped in the river. And that's not to account for all the logs that get moved around during power generation. 

I'm like you, I'm not going to go pounding rocks with it all day long, but having the mulligan that you speak of is very important, and for me, it is important enough to account for a major loss in performance. Without the plastic, any one of those bites could put me in the shop. With it, I might be able to make 15 or more misjudgements, before the boat looses the battle.


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## Darkside (Jan 11, 2012)

*Bassboy *- I know the Oops factor quite well. My previous boat was more of an eastern sled with very simple .190 bottom with a ton of extruded bracing. Performance was not defined by speed or even maneuverability, just getting from point A to point B and back every trip. It held up very well, but I did get into trouble when I put my brain on the shelf and tried to turn it into an all-terrain-vehicle.

We have some real tough looking places on the river. Here's just one and admittedly, the worst or second worse area in the harrisburg stretch of the Susquehanna. But honestly, you get much below 4' in the summer and you have to think long and hard. Below 3.3 you need your head examined.

This is Low Water in the Summer and Early Fall



 



This is High Water in the Early Winter





Even with the water up, every white spot on this map is a nasty rock just under the surface. And these areas are quite common in this stretch. Even with a tank and all the bracing, you're going to twist and tear stuff up. 

It is often better to live to fish another day, than to risk beating your boat up in super low water... We have to be able to let the boat sit in the driveway some days LOL


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## lowe1648 (Jan 12, 2012)

Did he have those boats done for customers or to test out with a different application? I'd love to run around in one next summer. My paper thin boat makes me turn around early on alot of the rivers I fish in low water.


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## Jim (Jan 12, 2012)

What would be a rough projected cost to get this added to a boat?


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## bulldog (Jan 12, 2012)

Jim said:


> What would be a rough projected cost to get this added to a boat?



+1


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## Darkside (Jan 12, 2012)

_*Lowe- *_ I think at least one of these was a test to see if Kevin himself was pleased with the protection and performance hits. I think the protection got an “A” but the performance was a “C-“, heck maybe even a D. I know that he sold that boat as a demo after using  it on shallow water for 12-18 months. He would have to chime in. 

_*Jim -*_ That is a great question- I think it depends on the choice of application and the cost of doing this in production vs. one guy doing it on his own boat. There are a number of advantages to the vacuum / adhesion process but the over head in materials and the equipment seems to be quite costly. The way we did this requires no special tools outside of what most home garage folk would have already. Circular saw, drills (corded and battery) and some hand tools. I did bring my portable table saw, and that did help. 

Obviously if you can buy the materials either in volume or at a vendor cost vs. a few sheets at retail you will save there. Largest expense is the UHMW and I’ve been quoted so many prices it is crazy to give you an accurate quote. I found prices from $11 - $15 a square foot over the years. This is best prices for ½ inch, some places were insane I just hung up the phone. The thread cutter screws I used were 28 cents each (best price I could find without going to China) and at that I had to buy a box of 1000. The stainless grade and hardness matters, so I couldn’t go with any old stainless screw even though I found some in the same size at 12 cents a screw. 

Doing 36” down the center of a LoPro is far less material than doing the hole bottom (On sled bottomed boats I’ve done full coverage on a 66” bottom boat, lots of weight and screws there LOL.


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## Kevin Turner (Jan 12, 2012)

Howdy guyz-
My keyboard time is short, but I want to offer thx to Chris and Vince for making the trip out to kick start this project. I'm anxouis to get her rigged and water tested.


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## Scottinva (Jan 12, 2012)

Chris, the boat looks great.

Scott


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## bassboy1 (Jan 13, 2012)

> It is often better to live to fish another day, than to risk beating your boat up in super low water... We have to be able to let the boat sit in the driveway some days LOL



Can't argue with that.

I like what you're doing with that boat, and would love to hear some detailed reports once you get it in the water.


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## Darkside (Jan 27, 2012)

One item we did not have time for the weekend I was there, was to finish off the leading edge of the _Turning Strakes _ and protect the blunt edge of the UHMW on the strakes. The plan was to add 1/2" of aluminum to match the edge. Will also make it much easier to replace the UHMW on the strake down the road, should there ever be a wear issue. nice part with the strakes is that the screw holes do-not emter the hull, just the aluminum angle that is welded onto the hull.

Kevin sent me a text today and it looks like his welder has matched it up real well.





Boat / Project is taking shape!


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## Darkside (Mar 1, 2012)

Recieved some updated pictures from Kevin this morning, boat looks like it will be out of rigging soon. 
I leave for MO in a week to bring the new ship home!

Updated pictures in the slide show below;

https://outdoors.webshots.com/slideshow/582138104zVKFjF


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## fool4fish1226 (Mar 2, 2012)

That is one sweet ride =D>


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## shallowminedid (Mar 3, 2012)

gonna take me for a ride?


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## AllOutdoors (Mar 3, 2012)

Looking good! Really loving my LoPRO DCC. The look on peoples face is priceless while skimming the shallow water here on KY lake at winter pool. While you see a few jets, you never see a River Pro. How much weight does the UHMW add? Does is affect turning or low rpm, slow speed shallow water lift? I still cant get over how well these boats lift at low rpm in shallow water.


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## Darkside (Mar 3, 2012)

The UHMW adds about 2.5lbs per sf, so figure 3’x 15’ is 45sf or an additional ~115lb
Would have to guess on the weight of the screws... 2-3lbs? 

We did this on a 2007 LoPro SCC, top speed when finished was just over 48mph. No sure if I could tell any difference in the turning without having the two side by side. Hoping this one performs much the same as that. We should know in a week or so.


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## Darkside (Mar 12, 2012)

Just a quick update-

The trip out to Missouri went well. We were able to get the boat out twice and test it in very skinny water. Even jumped a few dozen shoals to test the poly and the shallow capabilities of the craft. I am very pleased with the performance. I did lose a few feet of on plane burst and 1.5 to 2mph on top speed – which was expected. As for the burst I can't be too early to tell due to the break-in period on the engine.





Learned quickly that removing the UHMW turning strake covers, changes the performance, so that will be very interesting to see where that leads. I am nearly convinced that ¼” on the strakes would work better than ½” but that is all part of the process. I should be able to dial in the performance. 

The recessed intake worked very well, even when jumping gravel bars (no rocks in grate). This was my first time with the high skew impeller, seems to loads the pump very well, even in a ultra skinny water. Looking forward to more playing the next few weeks.

I updated the pictures, here is the link below that starts with the latest updates use the "next" box to the upper right of the photo. Will add more pictures in the next day or so. 

https://outdoors.webshots.com/photo/2060728510055846616Gwccyy

Still a fair amount of testing needs done...


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## bulldog (Aug 22, 2012)

Any updates on this? Is this going to be an option that Riverpro will offer in the future?


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## Kevin Turner (Aug 28, 2012)

bulldog said:


> Any updates on this? Is this going to be an option that Riverpro will offer in the future?


As it looks, I'll build a few this fall. If there's enough interest, I'll most likely tool up and offer it as an option.


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## bulldog (Aug 28, 2012)

Do you have a guess of what that option will cost? I'm trying to figure out what my total will be with the options I want.


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## Kevin Turner (Aug 29, 2012)

$1500 plus/minus. That said, I see little need for it around here?


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## bulldog (Aug 29, 2012)

Would that be $1500 on top of the $2000 hd bottom skid plate? it's not that we need them around here all the time but the one time I slam in to something with my $32k+ boat, the comfort of having it is worth the $1500+ to me. Thanks Kevin.


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## Kevin Turner (Sep 2, 2012)

$1500 will not provide a "killer bottom" structure like some Canadian builds (read heavy and mucho $$)...but will get ya 1/2" down the center keel plus standard bottom structure reinforcement. I'm kicking one off today...


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## skigill (Sep 6, 2012)

Kevin, what would be the cost to put uhmw on an existing boat( 201 lopro) ? How many days work to do it?


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## Kevin Turner (Sep 7, 2012)

Hey, what are doing over here? :LOL2: I'm not really sure given I've never retro'd a completed boat. As I get tooled up, I can give you a better answer. BTW, I'm building my first 190 ReCon / UHMW / Tunneled craft this week. I'll post pics later....


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## skigill (Sep 7, 2012)

Looking forward to the pics of the Recon! Thanks Kevin.


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