# Please please help me troubleshoot



## crankbait09 (Sep 1, 2013)

Okay, little rundown of my situation


My boss at work had never been fishing before, or if he has, it didn't amount to much at all. So we picked a day that we would hook up and i'd take him out and hopefully land him a couple fish and hopefully find a new hobby he'd like to pursue..........

if things could go wrong, they did....let me explain as well as ask a few "why's"

problem #1. Trolling motor - I have used this trolling motor a number of times with ZERO problems. Yesterday when I had it running, I just happened to see smoke coming from the trolling motor area below me. I look down, and the wires, wire nut, and electrical tape were melting before my eyes.. I quickly shut the motor off, went back to the battery compartment to see if the wires were hot there...no luck. everything was cool like normal. So I went up to the TM and started to peel off the electrical tape and the wire nut completely melted in half and I pulled it a part and it reminded me of taffy. Now, the red wire (hot) was perfectly fine, no heat, no issues what so ever. It was the black wire that had a complete meltdown. When I pulled the wire apart and tape and nut off, I couldn't see any issues to what could have caused this. Can anyone offer any ideas to what happened?

problem #2. transducer - this was prior to the TM issue but we were trolling along like normal and all of a sudden my depth finder screen went to zeros. I turned off, then back on, still zeros all across the board. SO I went to the transducer to see if the transducer some how fell off the boat. nope, still in tack. I searched for the wire, found it. it was cut in two. crap, I can splice that together and get it back up and running so no issue there. regardless, it was another item that was disabled.

problem #3. the engine. We left the dock and right before we hit the "no wake" bouey, the engine started coughing and jerking. I was thinking maybe an air in the line so I kept going. It worked it's way out (whatever it was), then a few minutes later, it did the same thing. It never stalled though. It was idling, and although it sounded bad, it continued to cough, jerk. I made it to the cove we were headed for, then the TM took over from there.........Then after we lost the TM, we decided to head back to dock, the engine was hard to start and the handle that controls the shifting, starting, and accelerating was very hard to turn....harder than normal. Finally I got the engine to start, so back to dock we started. Still running like crapola, we then lost a good 50-75% power and it seemed to run on one cylinder. Every once in awhile, the second boost of energy would kick in, and the motor would run the way it was supposed to. then a few seconds later, it would go out again. SO the engine finally dies but we had the dock in our sight, so my boss decided to get the oar out and paddle us in to shore.....thankfully we were close enough to dock that it wasnt that many rows before we docked.

I was really hoping to provide my boss with a fun day on the water but that did not happen. I think I am very grateful that he has a sense of humor. He was laughing a lot, during all this drama. I have to admit, I was laughing as well............we had a good time, nice bonding experience. He bought me lunch and we left laughing. He said he'd go out again with me, but I gotta get this boat situated.

sorry so wordy but thats my story. any advice on the motors would greatly be appreciated. I thought of taking the motor in to have it fixed but I'm hoping its easy enough for me to diagnose and fix........

I am far from boat motor savvy so if you could keep it in lame mans terms id appreciate it.

motor/boat specifics in signature


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## overboard (Sep 1, 2013)

Sounds like the old adage of bad things happening in 3's.
The engine cutting in and out could be a coil. 
As for the transducer wires. I know you can splice the power wires, but I don't think it's advisable on the transducer wires.


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## earl60446 (Sep 1, 2013)

1. bad connection at the wirenut, maybe solder it for next time

2. maybe you hit the transducer wire with the trolling motor, wild guess of course

3. fouled plugs might do that or bad plug(s)

I bet the boss was impressed #-o


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## crankbait09 (Sep 1, 2013)

earl,

1. that could be the issue. I also used a waterproof wire nut that has that gel inside of it to keep water out. Not sure if that was even needed

2. the transducer/wire is mounted at the tail end of the boat. the trolling motor is at the front

3. I will be checking the compression, the spark, and the plug wires tomorrow. I already tested the plugs and those look almost new.

the boss didnt seem to think to much of it.....more humorous than anything. All was good. I WILL get him out there one last time before the season is over. I have a couple months left.


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## crankbait09 (Sep 1, 2013)

How do you test the coils??? is there a way?


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## shawnfish (Sep 2, 2013)

[url=https://www.tinboats.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=328130#p328130 said:


> crankbait09 » Today, 21:13[/url]"]How do you test the coils??? is there a way?



how did you test the spark? if you simply held the plug on the motor and turned the motor over to see spark that will tell you nothing about if you have good spark, you need a spark tester so buy one or make one. they are cheap to buy and very simple to make. but...... before you do any of that you want to check and make sure you are getting fuel from your tank to your carburetor. when it was running you could have kept squeezing the ball on your fuel line and seen if it made it run ok. then make sure your carb is getting fuel in the bowl by priming the ball if not check all the connections on the fuel line between the tank and motor, motor to fuel pump and fuel pump to carb. 

check your throttle advance and make sure the cam roller and mark on the cam are aligned when the cam just begins to open.

from there like said above check the charge coil,sensor coil, power pack and ignition coil connections. now testing the current you will need a service manual and a voltage meter.


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## crankbait09 (Sep 2, 2013)

I have not tested for spark YET. I will get there later.

I ran the first test: Compression.

In the first cylinder, lets call it, "the top one". I am measuring 45psi
In the second cylinder, lets call it, "the bottom one". I am measuring 60psi

what dies this mean and what now? Should I continue the spark test or should I tackle this issue first?


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## shawnfish (Sep 2, 2013)

[url=https://www.tinboats.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=328155#p328155 said:


> crankbait09 » 18 minutes ago[/url]"]I have not tested for spark YET. I will get there later.
> 
> I ran the first test: Compression.
> 
> ...




first of all that means nothing because you have to figure out if you are getting fuel and have proper spark ( 1/4 bright blue snap!!) with a spark tester. and second you want those compression readings to be within 5psi of each other and those readings are pretty low and to fix that will not be easy or cheap. and what year,hp and model is your motor? I assume its the one in your signature since you never said. 

check fuel from tank to carb, then spark and we can go from there. it does no good to check things in reverse....


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## crankbait09 (Sep 2, 2013)

ok then, I will take the motor to the lake and test it for spark. I have an inline tester. I will post results once it has been done.

before the question comes up...the carb was just rebuilt last season. so it is fairly new.......

now if i dont have spark, then we dig deeper to test the coils, right?


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## shawnfish (Sep 2, 2013)

[url=https://www.tinboats.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=328161#p328161 said:


> crankbait09 » 28 minutes ago[/url]"]ok then, I will take the motor to the lake and test it for spark. I have an inline tester. I will post results once it has been done.
> 
> before the question comes up...the carb was just rebuilt last season. so it is fairly new.......
> 
> now if i dont have spark, then we dig deeper to test the coils, right?




you do not have to go to the lake to check spark. hook up your tester and pull the rope or hit your start button and see if the spark jumps the gap and snaps with a bright blue flash. then check your throttle/cam and make sure it is in sync. if it don't start now check the fuel supply from the tank to the carb(wich should be done first). now if you are getting fuel into the bowl but it still acts up you should take the carb off and clean it very good and blow out with compressed air. replace gaskets and put it back on and try to start it. if it don't start then you check your charge and sensor coil connections and the powerpack connections and if they are good and it wont start then all 3 need tested in wich case you need a service manual and a multi meter...


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## crankbait09 (Sep 2, 2013)

you do not have to go to the lake to check spark. hook up your tester and pull the rope or hit your start button and see if the spark jumps the gap and snaps with a bright blue flash. then check your throttle/cam and make sure it is in sync. if it don't start now check the fuel supply from the tank to the carb(wich should be done first). now if you are getting fuel into the bowl but it still acts up you should take the carb off and clean it very good and blow out with compressed air. replace gaskets and put it back on and try to start it. if it don't start then you check your charge and sensor coil connections and the powerpack connections and if they are good and it wont start then all 3 need tested in wich case you need a service manual and a multi meter...[/quote]

the red area, how do i do this?
I thought you had to have gas running through the system to create spark? no?
im afraid of it starting when I am not in the water......


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## crankbait09 (Sep 2, 2013)

ok, I ran the spark test with an inline tester. Here are my results:

The top spark plug (compression 1, 45psi) had a very faint spark in the tester.
The bottom spark plug (compression 2, 60psi) had a bright and healthy spark in the tester.

What do I do from here?


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## shawnfish (Sep 2, 2013)

[url=https://www.tinboats.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=328192#p328192 said:


> crankbait09 » 5 minutes ago[/url]"]ok, I ran the spark test with an inline tester. Here are my results:
> 
> The top spark plug (compression 1, 45psi) had a very faint spark in the tester.
> The bottom spark plug (compression 2, 60psi) had a bright and healthy spark in the tester.
> ...




don't ever start it and let it run if its not in a barrel or does not have muffs hooked up to a hose with water running. its ok to turn it over though.

did you check the plug wires and plugs? sounds like the bottom cylinder is getting good spark. if the plugs are good and you don't see visual damage to the top plug wire it sounds like you have a bad ignition coil because if the charging coil, sensor coil or power pack were bad neither cylinder would have good spark. you need to replace the bad ignition coil. if it were me I would replace both because chances are the other one may go bad soon...


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## crankbait09 (Sep 2, 2013)

ok, where do i go for these and are they expensive to replace? difficult???


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## shawnfish (Sep 2, 2013)

[url=https://www.tinboats.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=328197#p328197 said:


> crankbait09 » 17 minutes ago[/url]"]ok, where do i go for these and are they expensive to replace? difficult???




marine parts store.... or online. iboats.com,marineengines.com, boats.net etc..... should be around 20 bucks apiece.
they are easy to replace but still not knowing for sure what motor you have I cant be sure. if its the 66 then you have to remove the flywheel I think and if so it can be easy or hard just depends if the flywheel wants to come off easy or hard. you will need a flywheel puller to remove it and make SURE you use grade 8 bolts to connect the puller to the fly, if you don't use grade 8 they may break off in the flywheel then you have a problem....


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## Charger25 (Sep 3, 2013)

Before buying parts,might want to check for any frayed wires or loose / corroded connections. Follow top cyl plug wire all the way back to magneto and points.
As far as testing the coils, I used a DMV and checked the ohms, wouldn't hurt to ohm out the plug wires also.


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## shawnfish (Sep 3, 2013)

[url=https://www.tinboats.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=328240#p328240 said:


> Charger25 » Today, 04:53[/url]"]Before buying parts,might want to check for any frayed wires or loose / corroded connections. Follow top cyl plug wire all the way back to magneto and points.
> As far as testing the coils, I used a DMV and checked the ohms, wouldn't hurt to ohm out the plug wires also.



thanks... I could have sworn I told him to check wires and connections.....and your right that motor don't have charge and sensor coils. points and condensors I believe. he never did say yr,make or HP so I assume its his signature motor????


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## crankbait09 (Sep 3, 2013)

From what I can tell..the visible connection points are fine. I have not removed the magneto to check connections.........

My bad, I thought I told everyone boat specifics. 1966, evinrude, fastwin, 18 hp


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## shawnfish (Sep 3, 2013)

your flywheel will come right off with the puller or it is gonna give you a good fight. DONT FORGET TO USE GRADE 8 BOLTS
don't forget to loosen the flywheel nut about one turn so the fly has room to pop off, don't take the nut all the way off because the flywheel could fly off and knock your teeth out.
if you get the puller on and tighten real good and it don't pop off spray some 3 in one or some wd-40 under and around the nut so it can work down the shaft. after a few minutes give it a few taps with a hammer but use a chunk of wood so your not directly tapping the fly with the hammer. good taps just don't hit it hard. if that don't work soak it again and tighten the puller some more and wait an hour or a while and repeat above process. mine took almost 2 days to come off.....the condensors and points are cheap so you may as well replace them too.....


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## crankbait09 (Sep 3, 2013)

[url=https://www.tinboats.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=328270#p328270 said:


> shawnfish » Today, 11:02[/url]"]your flywheel will come right off with the puller or it is gonna give you a good fight. DONT FORGET TO USE GRADE 8 BOLTS
> don't forget to loosen the flywheel nut about one turn so the fly has room to pop off, don't take the nut all the way off because the flywheel could fly off and knock your teeth out.
> if you get the puller on and tighten real good and it don't pop off spray some 3 in one or some wd-40 under and around the nut so it can work down the shaft. after a few minutes give it a few taps with a hammer but use a chunk of wood so your not directly tapping the fly with the hammer. good taps just don't hit it hard. if that don't work soak it again and tighten the puller some more and wait an hour or a while and repeat above process. mine took almost 2 days to come off.....the condensors and points are cheap so you may as well replace them too.....



sentence in red...what do I need to use grade 8 bolts for? 

do I NEED to remove the magneto yet? I only need to remove this when I'm ready to replace coils, right?


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## shawnfish (Sep 3, 2013)

[url=https://www.tinboats.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=328292#p328292 said:


> crankbait09 » 14 minutes ago[/url]"]
> 
> 
> [url=https://www.tinboats.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=328270#p328270 said:
> ...



what do you need grade 8 bolts for?? unless you know a trick to get underneath the flywheel without removing it. all that stuff is under the flywheel. you are going to need the flywheel puller with 3 GRADE 8 bolts 1/4 inch I believe. MUST BE GRADE 8 anything less could (WILL!!) break of in the flywheel and then its never coming off. GRADE 8 BOLTS do you have a service manual? is it a factory manual?


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## shawnfish (Sep 3, 2013)

I just thought of something...did you check(visually) the crankcase seals? if they are bad you could be getting air from a leak in that bad cylinder and that would make it backfire and run bad. you never did say if that plug that had bad spark jumped the gap in the tester? what did you have the gap set at? same for both wires? 1/4 is sufficient but real good spark will jump 3/8 and that's how I test mine( once)....just wanna make sure cuz it could be a combo of both leaky gasket on the crankcase and bad spark....


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## crankbait09 (Sep 3, 2013)

I have never removed a flywheel......ever.

as i mentioned, this is all new to me. so anything that you can tell me to accomplish this task would be appreciated.

I do have a Seloc repair manual but it doesnt mention anything about needing grade 8 bolts. It mentions using a flywheel puller, but nothing about specific bolts.


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## crankbait09 (Sep 3, 2013)

as for the crankcase seals.......i VISUALLY dont see anything that raises a red flag.......

as for that "jump thing", i actually used an inline tester.........


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## shawnfish (Sep 3, 2013)

[url=https://www.tinboats.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=328302#p328302 said:


> crankbait09 » Today, 14:01[/url]"]as for the crankcase seals.......i VISUALLY dont see anything that raises a red flag.......
> 
> as for that "jump thing", i actually used an inline tester.........




yes... the inline tester has a wire you plug into the spark plug boot on one end and on the other end has a spark plug boot that goes on your spark plug while its inside the cylinder. and inside the tester theres a gap where the wires do not connect, when you have it hooked up properly and turn your motor over your spark should jump across the gap where the wires don't touch inside the tester and you can see it. most of them have increments so you can set the gap at 1/8 1/4 3/8 etc.... you want it to jump at least 1/4 inch gap and hear a sharp snap sound and it should be a very bright blue in color.... check your inbox in a few minutes..gonna PM you


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