# Open carry- this happened in my own backyard!



## wasilvers (Feb 22, 2010)

Wiconsin is one of the few states that do have a concealed carry law. It's been voted in twice and vetoed twice. The gov promises to veto every bill that comes to him with concealed carry in it. 

Till late last year, if you did open carry, you were given a ticket for disturbing the peace. Finally the attorney general said NO, that was wrong. The kicker case was a guy who mowed his lawn and had a rifle leaning against a tree. He never left his OWN property! His only fault was living next to a busy road and being ' a guy with a gun' - he was given disorderly ticket - which he fought. Oh and after the AG says the disorderly tickets are wrong, 3-4 police departments say they will continue to issue them. CRAZY.

Anyway, a guy got kicked out of a restaurant right down the street from me. It doesn't seem like anyone complained about him, it's like the officers knew him already (my view) - here's the video..
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And here's what he started...
https://www.jsonline.com/news/waukesha/84928722.html
(here's the text)
*Gun-toting demonstrators gather in Sussex *
Sussex — Clutching cups of coffee and chatting in loose groups, the people outside Starbucks on Sunday didn't look particularly unusual, save for the holstered guns strapped to nearly everyone's hip or thigh.

The display of Smith & Wessons, Glocks and Kel-Tec pistols among lattes and coffeecake was part of an organized rally to spread awareness about Wisconsin's open carry law as well as the recent treatment of a Sussex gun carrier by local law enforcement. Participants later drove to the Wisconsin State Patrol District Headquarters in Waukesha and demonstrated on the front lawn.

The turnout - about 40 people from various parts of Wisconsin and Illinois - may indicate growing support for the expansion of gun rights in the state, and in particular, legislation that could make it possible for people to carry concealed weapons.

State law allows adults to openly carry guns, but not in businesses that ask them not to, places that serve alcohol, and not in school zones or public buildings. Last spring, Attorney General J.B. Van Hollen re-affirmed in a brief the right of Wisconsin's residents to bear arms openly, saying that those who do so should not be subject to disorderly conduct tickets from local law enforcement.

"That was the floodgate," said New Berlin resident Nik Clark, who organized the rally Sunday and is the president of Wisconsin Carry Inc., a new statewide organization pushing for expanded gun rights. "It verified what people already knew, but some people were still afraid to carry their guns openly until that opinion came out."

Clark said Sunday's gathering was prompted by what members perceived as improper law enforcement action against Sussex resident Joseph Schneider.

Earlier this month, a Wisconsin State Patrol officer approached Schneider at China Wok in Sussex and asked him to take his gun out of the business. Schneider, who said he has openly carried his gun many times at the China Wok in Sussex without a problem, videotaped the encounter and then left the restaurant.

The video clip shows the officer first asking the restaurant owners if they allowed guns in the restaurant. After appearing confused, the employees said no, they did not allow guns.

Later that day, Schneider was questioned by Waukesha County Sherriff's Department deputies on suspicion that he might have been impersonating a police officer.

The State Patrol District Headquarters in Waukesha was closed Sunday and no representative could be reached for comment. As for the Waukesha County Sheriff's Department, Public Information Officer Steve Pederson said that the sheriff's deputies acted appropriately, and that their questioning had nothing to do with Schneider openly carrying a gun.

"We have gotten reports from other areas about people impersonating police officers," Pederson said, adding that some of the equipment seen in or on Schneider's car, such as a radar gun and police scanner and antennas, led them to follow up on the lead.

Pederson said that Schneider was cooperative, and that the officers did not find evidence to support that Schneider was impersonating law enforcement.

News of Schneider's story spread on the Internet and through online social networks, prompting gun rights advocates to believe Schneider was unfairly treated.

"We all believe we should be allowed to defend ourselves," said Krysta Sutterfield, a Milwaukee resident who recently bought a 9mm Kel-Tec pistol that she carries openly. "If people see a gun, they automatically think criminal. But criminals don't wear their guns in holsters."

Shaun Kranish, a rally participant from Rockford, Ill., said support for a concealed carry law is growing in Wisconsin. Twice, Gov. Jim Doyle has vetoed legislation that would make that possible.

"Almost every state has moved toward fewer restrictions on guns, except Wisconsin and Illinois," said Kranish, who started the Web site https://www.ICarry.org to build support for concealed carry laws in both states.

The difference between open carry and concealed carry, beyond the visibility aspect, is that just about any adult may openly carry a gun, while those who carry concealed weapons generally must purchase a permit and be trained in how to use the firearm.

Gun rights advocates generally support concealed carry because they think it makes it harder for criminals to know who is armed and who isn't, Kranish said. That fear and uncertainty, he added, can help reduce criminal activity.

Those opposed to expanding gun rights generally think the move can lead to more guns being displayed prematurely, more accidents and more violence.


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## KICKEDBACK (Feb 22, 2010)

just wanted to mention that Arizona is trying to pass some more gun laws that will again prove that lawfully owning and carrying a weapon is in the citizens rights as well as the constitution of the USA. you may want to look at some recently passed laws and the new proposed ones for some information on the reasons so you can be better informed and make your lawmakers do what you want and not what a hand full of "progressives" want "for you". the only power we have left is our vote and we all need to use it and get rid of all the lifetime politicians that do not represent us, just themselves.thats my story and I'm sticken to it.now back to my 14' mirro-craft and the 15hp motor that spun a impeller pin and got hot! :mrgreen:


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## river_wolf (Feb 22, 2010)

Well said Kicked back. Through 23 years in the Navy, I have lived in a lot of places through the US both good and bad. it is amazing how some states do what "THEY SAY" is right for the people and there are the blind who just follow. Its a shame. Here is GA, you don’t get a CCW. You get a Firearms License. This allows you to carry open or concealed. I usually carry concealed however have forgot to put a jacket on going in to a store from time to time. What is amazing to me, its not the store owners that get excited, but have got some funny looks to other customers. 

There was a movement made up in the northeast a few months ago that shows some people are getting tired of the long term "This is how we should do it" movement. God bless them!!


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## DocWatson (Feb 23, 2010)

Maybe I'm missing something, but the video seem to show a police officer asking someone to leave a PRIVATE business because the OWNER does not allow guns in their establishment. Your civil and constitutional right to carry end at the door of a PRIVATE residence or business. End of discussion. You have rights, but so does the property owner.

The issue is respect, not rights. Respect the law AND the rights of others in every situation.


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## Troutman3000 (Feb 23, 2010)

DocWatson said:


> Maybe I'm missing something, but the video seem to show a police officer asking someone to leave a PRIVATE business because the OWNER does not allow guns in their establishment. Your civil and constitutional right to carry end at the door of a PRIVATE residence or business. End of discussion. You have rights, but so does the property owner.
> 
> The issue is respect, not rights. Respect the law AND the rights of others in every situation.




The officer was not called in for this guy. He was eating there and then saw the gun. He then asked the owner if he allowed guns in the store, the owner said no and so out the guy went. The point is the officer had no right to approach that guy or the owner. There was no crime being committed the officer just wanted to be big.


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## wasilvers (Feb 23, 2010)

Yes, he wanted to be big. Makes me wonder what will happen when they find me shooting my airguns in my garage. 

Apparently the villiage laws say he can't carry anyway, but I guess that is superceeded by the Bill of Rights  

_DISCHARGING AND *CARRYING FIREARMS *AND GUNS PROHIBITED. No person, except a sheriff, constable, police officer or their deputies, shall fire or discharge any firearm, rifle, spring or air gun of any description, bow and arrow or sling shot within the Village *or have any firearm, rifle, spring or air gun in his possession or under his control, unless it is *unloaded and knocked down or unloaded and enclosed within a carrying case or other suitable container, provided this section shall not prevent the maintenance and use of duly supervised rifle or pistol ranges or shooting galleries authorized by the Village Board except as herein provided:_ ... it goes on to say you can shoot a bb gun on your property or a 22 and bow&arrows in your basement.


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## Quackrstackr (Feb 23, 2010)

Thank God I live in Kentucky.

We can even discharge firearms within the city limits where I live so long as it is not endangering life or property. :mrgreen:


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## Jim (Feb 23, 2010)

Quackrstackr said:


> Thank God I live in Kentucky.
> 
> We can even discharge firearms within the city limits where I live so long as it is not endangering life or property. :mrgreen:



That is awesome!


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## Troutman3000 (Feb 23, 2010)

wasilvers said:


> Yes, he wanted to be big. Makes me wonder what will happen when they find me shooting my airguns in my garage.
> 
> Apparently the villiage laws say he can't carry anyway, but I guess that is superceeded by the Bill of Rights
> 
> _DISCHARGING AND *CARRYING FIREARMS *AND GUNS PROHIBITED. No person, except a sheriff, constable, police officer or their deputies, shall fire or discharge any firearm, rifle, spring or air gun of any description, bow and arrow or sling shot within the Village *or have any firearm, rifle, spring or air gun in his possession or under his control, unless it is *unloaded and knocked down or unloaded and enclosed within a carrying case or other suitable container, provided this section shall not prevent the maintenance and use of duly supervised rifle or pistol ranges or shooting galleries authorized by the Village Board except as herein provided:_ ... it goes on to say you can shoot a bb gun on your property or a 22 and bow&arrows in your basement.



State Laws preempt local ordinances on gun codes I believe. Here in Georgia we have decent gun laws but the problem lies in the interpretation of the word "public places". It's not very clear at all.


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## FishinsMyLife (Feb 23, 2010)

Jim said:


> Quackrstackr said:
> 
> 
> > Thank God I live in Kentucky.
> ...



X2


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## DocWatson (Feb 23, 2010)

Troutman3000 said:


> DocWatson said:
> 
> 
> > Maybe I'm missing something, but the video seem to show a police officer asking someone to leave a PRIVATE business because the OWNER does not allow guns in their establishment. Your civil and constitutional right to carry end at the door of a PRIVATE residence or business. End of discussion. You have rights, but so does the property owner.
> ...


Who was the private citizen open carrying in public and who is the person representing the public interest ?? 

The guy did the right thing, putting the gun in the car. All he would have accomplished by saying no and standing up for his "rights" would be to have give the officer an opportunity to really look big by arresting him and ruining his day. All I'm saying is you've gotta pick your battles.


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## Troutman3000 (Feb 23, 2010)

deleted...double post


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## Troutman3000 (Feb 23, 2010)

DocWatson said:


> Troutman3000 said:
> 
> 
> > DocWatson said:
> ...



I would have done the same thing too, but if he wanted to he could have taken that one to court and won. But what would he really win?


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## DocWatson (Feb 23, 2010)

Troutman3000 said:


> I would have done the same thing too, but if he wanted to he could have taken that one to court and won. But what would he really win?


My point exactly. Being right is not always the winning position. :wink:


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## river_wolf (Feb 24, 2010)

Troutman3000 said:


> State Laws preempt local ordinances on gun codes I believe. Here in Georgia we have decent gun laws but the problem lies in the interpretation of the word "public places". It's not very clear at all.



True, out of all the states that I have lived, Georgia has to be one of the more liberal states. the good part is according to the law here, if you have no criminal or mental history, the state is required to give you a license. and it is only around 46 bucks and takes roughly 3 to 6 weeks. No class or training required. Now, the down side to this, you have people who have never owned a gun that are now getting scared buying a gun, getting their license and have no actual knowledge of the use. This can and will lead to issues that are going to the negative. 

NOW. What is really sick, In order for me to carry a weapon in my job, I have to take a class, qualify according to the state, which I did back in December and I am STILL waiting on my blue card!!!! Go figure......


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## river_wolf (Feb 24, 2010)

DocWatson said:


> My point exactly. Being right is not always the winning position. :wink:



Very true, then who knows, Here is Georgia the courts some times have strange interpretations of the law.....


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## Jim (Feb 24, 2010)

river_wolf said:


> DocWatson said:
> 
> 
> > My point exactly. Being right is not always the winning position. :wink:
> ...



Can't be worse then here in Mass. :LOL2:


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## river_wolf (Feb 24, 2010)

Just remember, Chicago has not carry law, and they still have one of the highest crime rates in the nation!!!!


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