# If true, not good.



## Crazyboat (Mar 8, 2021)

https://boattest.com/article/new-carb-proposals-threaten-future-outboard-engines?utm_source=iContact&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=boattestcom-newsletter&utm_content=Mon+3.8

If this is true by 2027 outboard emissions will have to be cut by 40% on powers 50hp and under and 70% for powers over 50 HP.

For you tinners out there, outboards 25 and under will be done AWAY with and replaced by electric outboards over stages.

You may want to stock up on some portables and hold on to them, their value is about to increase.


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## CedarRiverScooter (Mar 8, 2021)

Good thing outboards last decades if taken care of!


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## DaleH (Mar 8, 2021)

You know this is for *KALIFORNIA *.. right? _Whackos & communists ... _less our own LDUBS on here of course ...

I do understand that sometimes_, "as goes Califronia, so goes the US ... "_


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## LDUBS (Mar 8, 2021)

DaleH said:


> You know this is for *KALIFORNIA *.. right? _Whackos & communists ... _less our own LDUBS on here of course ...
> 
> I do understand that sometimes_, "as goes Califronia, so goes the US ... "_




Yep, it will be coming soon to your state. I'm all for making things better but I think there is a lack of common sense or balance and it will only get worse -- unless you get reasonable folks in elected positions to keep a balance. Sadly, with my state's jungle primary system, it may be too late for California.


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## Crazyboat (Mar 8, 2021)

An electric like a Torpedo is fine enough for a jon boat if you just want to get across a small lake or visit a nearby neighbor. How do they expect you to lug 2, 4 heavy deep cycle batteries to the house, garage or shed for recharging, every God damned day in some cases?

I agree with the member that said "Thank god if taken care of they will last decades."

But try getting parts at some point. Hell I'm 58, if I buy one at 65 I'll never need another, but what about my kids 11 and 13, electric has it's applications, right now a boat ain't one of them.


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## CRS (Mar 10, 2021)

Electric motors are not even close in performance, because of the batteries. I must use electric because the lake I fish on is electric only, it's a small lake by comparison 7,380 acres. The difficulty is the batteries required to operate an electric motor, the bigger the motor the more batteries required. Add more batteries you add weight, weight puts the boat deeper into the water requiring more power, more power requires still more batteries. Even the larger electric outboards will not get a boat up on plane, forget using a very small boat because it will not carry the weight of the required batteries for the larger electric motors. I have a 14 foot Tracker Grizzly I have 2 80 pound thrust MinnKotas on the back and a 80 pound thrust MinnKota Ultera on the front. With calm winds all motors running full force drawing 60 amps each I reach the blistering speed of 4MPH. I can run this way for an incredible 1 hour before damaging my 6 125 amp hour AGM batteries 50% draw down. It's close to replacement time and I am considering LiFePO-4 batteries 6 of them 100 amp hour just south of $5000. 
Moral of this rant, fight like hell against going electric.


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## overboard (Mar 10, 2021)

IMO, battery technology is in its infancy and you ain't seen nuttin yet! 
I've already read several articles about electric airplanes, and some cars powered by electric motors are unbelievably powerful and fast, it's just a matter of time before the internal combustion engine becomes obsolete.


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## CedarRiverScooter (Mar 10, 2021)

If my kids are still letting me boat by then (I doubt it), I'll be running a big genset in the bow.

Always a way around rules.


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## InSaneFisherMan (Mar 11, 2021)

In Europe, they recently approved a process for fighting fires in electric cars.

The process is to submerge the entire car in a tank of water.

I guess in a boat you would just sink it.

Shutting down a few social media tech companies would probably reduce co2 more than boats.

It should be all about a clean environment, not political optics!


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## CRS (Mar 12, 2021)

overboard said:


> IMO, battery technology is in its infancy and you ain't seen nuttin yet!
> I've already read several articles about electric airplanes, and some cars powered by electric motors are unbelievably powerful and fast, it's just a matter of time before the internal combustion engine becomes obsolete.



You are correct batteries are in their infancy and have been for years. The internal combustion engine probably will at some point become obsolete.
The big problem is NOW, politicians that know nothing about anything except filling their own bank accounts are pushing legislation based on nothing but getting votes. The time will come that electric or perhaps something we have never even thought of will replace the internal combustion engine.
Big problem is nothing is available for small craft AKA pleasure fishing boats, so stick with and fight for the only practical means of propulsion for your boat.


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## RaisedByWolves (Mar 12, 2021)

overboard said:


> IMO, battery technology is in its infancy and you ain't seen nuttin yet!
> I've already read several articles about electric airplanes, and some cars powered by electric motors are unbelievably powerful and fast, it's just a matter of time before the internal combustion engine becomes obsolete.



They have been obsolete several times now, but they just keep getting better.

I believe the term your thinking of is “Too expensive”, but batteries for the near term are even more expensive.


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## LDUBS (Mar 12, 2021)

InSaneFisherMan said:


> It should be all about a clean environment, not political optics!





CRS said:


> overboard said:
> 
> 
> > IMO, battery technology is in its infancy and you ain't seen nuttin yet!
> ...



I think you guys are right. The technology curve is pretty steep and it is likely we will have viable options in the future. Sadly, the political scamming is a real issue to meaningful and balanced change.


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## Crazyboat (Mar 12, 2021)

CRS said:


> Electric motors are not even close in performance, because of the batteries. I must use electric because the lake I fish on is electric only, it's a small lake by comparison 7,380 acres. The difficulty is the batteries required to operate an electric motor, the bigger the motor the more batteries required. Add more batteries you add weight, weight puts the boat deeper into the water requiring more power, more power requires still more batteries. Even the larger electric outboards will not get a boat up on plane, forget using a very small boat because it will not carry the weight of the required batteries for the larger electric motors. I have a 14 foot Tracker Grizzly I have 2 80 pound thrust MinnKotas on the back and a 80 pound thrust MinnKota Ultera on the front. With calm winds all motors running full force drawing 60 amps each I reach the blistering speed of 4MPH. I can run this way for an incredible 1 hour before damaging my 6 125 amp hour AGM batteries 50% draw down. It's close to replacement time and I am considering LiFePO-4 batteries 6 of them 100 amp hour just south of $5000.
> Moral of this rant, fight like hell against going electric.



I'd rather have a 2hp kicker then any battery option at this point. Torpedo makes a good electric motor but for reasons you mention, it's not practical.


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## InSaneFisherMan (Mar 13, 2021)

It’s interesting that a study at a university found that fertilizer are responsible for 25% of NOx. 

Political deception??? Why not ban fertilizer?

A recent study conducted by the University of California Davis, found that adding nitrogen fertilizer to soil in California is contributing 25 percent or more to state-wide NOx pollution levels.[17] When nitrogen fertilizer is added to the soil, excess ammonium and nitrate not used by plants can be converted to NO by microorganism in the soil, which escapes into the air. NOx is a precursor for smog formation which is already a known issue for the state of California. In addition to contributing to smog, when nitrogen fertilizer is added to the soil and the excess is released in the form of NO, or leached as nitrate this can be a costly process for the farming industry.


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## InSaneFisherMan (Mar 13, 2021)

THC emissions from gas engines

Owing to their high efficiency and lower NOx and soot emissions, gas engines are frequently used in decentralised energy supply systems. However, they can emit high amounts of unburned hydrocarbons (THC – Total Hydro Carbon). The project has set itself the goal of identifying engine-related measures for optimised combustion and thus minimise THC emissions. Comprehensive experimental tests were conducted using a single-cylinder research engine and an optical engine. These served to verify the newly developed simulation model with which the THC content can be reliably pre-determined. The level of THC emissions depends especially on the air-fuel ratio. When all relevant parameters are optimally aligned, these emissions can be dramatically reduced and the effectiveness further increased. However, the higher resulting NOx values must be compensated for using an effective exhaust gas treatment.


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## Crazyboat (Mar 13, 2021)

Not to mention all the runoff pollution it causes, Fl has tons of RED tide issues almost every year on the west coast because of it.


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## MrGiggles (Mar 14, 2021)

CRS said:


> Electric motors are not even close in performance, because of the batteries. I must use electric because the lake I fish on is electric only, it's a small lake by comparison 7,380 acres. The difficulty is the batteries required to operate an electric motor, the bigger the motor the more batteries required. Add more batteries you add weight, weight puts the boat deeper into the water requiring more power, more power requires still more batteries. Even the larger electric outboards will not get a boat up on plane, forget using a very small boat because it will not carry the weight of the required batteries for the larger electric motors. I have a 14 foot Tracker Grizzly I have 2 80 pound thrust MinnKotas on the back and a 80 pound thrust MinnKota Ultera on the front. With calm winds all motors running full force drawing 60 amps each I reach the blistering speed of 4MPH. I can run this way for an incredible 1 hour before damaging my 6 125 amp hour AGM batteries 50% draw down. It's close to replacement time and I am considering LiFePO-4 batteries 6 of them 100 amp hour just south of $5000.
> Moral of this rant, fight like hell against going electric.



Trolling motors are made for lugging big, heavy boats around quietly at low speed. You could strap the biggest, baddest trolling motor they make onto a canoe and still only get 4 mph, they're not made for high speed. 

Lithium batteries and brushless motors are changing all that. There are already electric outboards on the market, but the infrastructure isn't there for them yet (not many docks have the power available to fast charge a huge battery bank), and the tech is still new enough that the cost is prohibitive.


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## CedarRiverScooter (Mar 14, 2021)

Not to mention that water + electricity are a bad mix. Good thing this is far out in the future.


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## wis bang (Mar 20, 2021)

Time to tear down Pappy's Elgin now hanging in the rafters of the shed...get a hold of the man making new impellers...3/4ths of a pint to the gal and away we go in a big cloud of smoke. It's been sitting, dry, since the late 60's, has compression and spark....


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## InSaneFisherMan (Mar 23, 2021)

Sanctuary Lakes, a place where outboards that contributed so much to outdoor recreation can go and continue to provide enjoyment.


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