# First boat mod, am I safe adding a livewell??



## gifamilies (Sep 24, 2008)

Here's the basics,
I just purchased a 1982 Alumacraft with a 30HP 1991 'Rude and I'm trying to determine if it would be safe/prudent to add a small (20 gallons or so) livewell as I'm doing the build up. I cannot find a HP/weight tag anywhere on the boat, so I'm trying to do a "good judgement" call here. 

The measurements on the hull are as follows:
(these are all inside to inside measurements, usable space in other words)
178.375" L (stem to stern) 52.675 W (rear) 51.875" W where the bow begins to noticeably "V" (48.5" from the tip)

I'll also be carrying 3 batteries (1 start, 2 troll/electronics/etc) a 46lb bow mount minn kota, myself (225) my wife (she won't tell, but about 130) and our gear (2 rods each, tackle boxes, etc)

I plan to build a casting deck from the 2nd seat all the way to the rear, and another from just in front of the console all the way into the bow. I'll be using 1X1X1/8 alum. angle for the frame/bracing and 3/8 ply for the decks/hatches/storage.
Like I said, the big question is, can I safely add a 20Gal livewell without endangering my wife or the boat.

As I've just discovered this board over the past few days, I also plan to show pictures of the buildup as it goes along 

Thanks,
Andrew


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## Waterwings (Sep 24, 2008)

Welcome Aboard! 8) 

From your measurements you have roughly a 1452 the way I read it. Where are going to locate the livewell? Near the stern or midships maybe? Carrying 3 batteries (all in the stern?), plus an outboard, is already a bit of weight, so you might think about locating the livewell a little further fwd. Just my thoughts, and there will other members along with their thoughts and ideas. So sort through the tips/suggestions and decide what will _safely_ work for you and the family. :wink:


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## gifamilies (Sep 24, 2008)

Thanks for the reply,



> Carrying 3 batteries (all in the stern?)



Actually, I'd planned to put the start battery in the stern, and locate the two others in the bow to even out the weight a bit



> Where are going to locate the livewell? Near the stern or midships maybe?



I was thinking about something running about 3/4 the width of boat, just behind the middle seat, 
perhaps I should rethink it, and position it just in front of the front seat?? or perhaps remove the middle seat and make it a seat/livewell combo??

Thanks again!!


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## Waterwings (Sep 24, 2008)

Sounds like you've got a plan for keeping the rig in trim. Just a suggestion, but perhaps before you go to cuttin' and bangin', fill a cooler or something portable with water that would equal the weight of a livewell, and place it in a couple different locations on the boat while it's floating, just to get an idea of how the weight distribution will be.


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## ben2go (Sep 25, 2008)

Waterwings said:


> Sounds like you've got a plan for keeping the rig in trim. Just a suggestion, but perhaps before you go to cuttin' and bangin', fill a cooler or something portable with water that would equal the weight of a livewell, and place it in a couple different locations on the boat while it's floating, just to get an idea of how the weight distribution will be.



I agree.You could build a cooler into a live well and it will be removable/movable for weight savings.Cheaper than an off the shelf unit.Just a passing thought. 8)


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## gifamilies (Sep 25, 2008)

Thanks for the suggestions, I think I'll fill up the cooler this weekend and take it out to test different locations. 

The way I've got it set in my mind, my front and rear decks will be about the same weight, so as long as I've got all the other gear roughly where I'm going to position it, I should get a pretty good feel for where the livewell should go without having to put the decks in to test it. I understand that the decks will add some overall weight, but it should be fairly well distributed so as not to effect the overall trim/handling short of slowing me down a bit.

Is my thinking right on this, or should I mock up the decks as well??


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## dedawg1149 (Sep 25, 2008)

i would do the seat livewell combo


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## gifamilies (Sep 25, 2008)

Thanks dedawg,
As I'm at work right now and not home to take measurements, I've thought of, and talked myself out of several scenarios in the past 4 or 5 hours. My wife also pointed out that I need to consider the weight of kids and dogs in this thing as well. I don't know whose kids, as I don't have any, so this may turn into more of a family discussion than I first thought. Wish me luck on that front!!


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## SlimeTime (Sep 25, 2008)

Is your middle seat wide enough to sink a cooler into (or buy a manufactured livewell & hatch)? You could always put seats on both sides if you have kids. Use pin-style bases & you can remove them when they aren't required.

ST


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## gifamilies (Sep 25, 2008)

No, the seats are 11.75" wide, which is probably too narrow for an ice chest & or a premanufactured unit. I am considering building a custom 'glass/aluminum combo and replacing one of the existing seats with it, probably the center seat, so as not to effect weight distribution. 

Finally, the problem with the kids comment is, as far as I know, I DON'T HAVE ANY, so now I'm slightly worried as to why my wife thinks I need to provide space for them. [-o<


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## ben2go (Sep 25, 2008)

gifamilies said:


> Thanks dedawg,
> As I'm at work right now and not home to take measurements, I've thought of, and talked myself out of several scenarios in the past 4 or 5 hours. My wife also pointed out that I need to consider the weight of kids and dogs in this thing as well. I don't know whose kids, as I don't have any, so this may turn into more of a family discussion than I first thought. Wish me luck on that front!!



The fishing trips will only last 9 more months.Then your trading your tackle in for a diaper bag.If she isn't with child she's dropping hints that she wants to be with child.If she's with child,all I can say is, sorry for your loss(fishing).You will gain a fishing buddy in time tho. :wink: 

If she says she with child,ask her if she told the mail man he's gonna have a kid.I got confused looks for that one, seeing how our mailman is a beautiful woman.


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## gifamilies (Sep 25, 2008)

> I got confused looks for that one, seeing how our mailman is a beautiful woman.



At the risk of being to risque' for this board, aren't most guys willing to pay extra for that?? :lol: 

Now, on to the subject more at hand for me, when I got home from work, I piled all my stuff in it's appropriate places in the boat (batteries, TM, etc...) and put some scraps of plywood in front and back to approximate the wood that would be in place for the decking. I quickly learned that she "wallows", which is a highly technical term we non-sailors use when we really mean squirrelly If the live well (48qt ice chest full of water) is placed anywhere but about 12" in front of center, so that answers the initial question.

Now that that's settled, I'll move on to rewiring the whole thing, as the former owner thought that 16Ga wire (not fused, of course) would be enough for everything, including the 110 volt outlet he put in the bow for the trolling motor outlet!!
Can I use standard car audio type wiring (got about 100' each of 4, 8 & 10ga) or do I need to look for "marine" rated wiring??
I'll not be going into any saltwater environments, as I live in the middle of Texas, so corrosion from salt, etc. is not a concern.

Thanks,
Andrew


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## Zum (Sep 25, 2008)

Marine grades probably better but if I had 100' of 4/8gauge I'd be using that.Just make sure you seal the bare wire,heat shrink tubing is great stuff.Heres a good link to figure out what size wire you need for the trolling motor:https://www.minnkotamotors.com/view.asp?url=/support/faq/general&pt=6


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## Zum (Sep 25, 2008)

https://www.minnkotamotors.com/view.asp?url=/support/faq/general&pt=6
for some reason when I edit it wouldn't go to the site...direct


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## gifamilies (Sep 25, 2008)

Zum said:


> https://www.minnkotamotors.com/view.asp?url=/support/faq/general&pt=6
> for some reason when I edit it wouldn't go to the site...direct



Thanks for the link. When it comes to wire gauges, I've always believed in the "bigger is better, but only to a point" theory.
That link, and a lot of previous experience with car stereo installation leads me to the following sizes I'll be using for my electrical hookups:

For battery to battery links, such as with my paralleled troll batteries, I'll be using 1.5' runs of 0 (ought gauge) with a 60amp circuit breaker between the positive poles. 
From the battery to the troll/charge plug, I'm running 4Ga, off of the positive of one battery (30amp breaker) and the negative of the other, so that when I unplug the trolling motor and plug in the battery charger, I get an even charge across both batteries. 
From the plug to the TM, I'll be running 8Ga, although 4Ga would be more efficient, I'm willing to sacrifice efficiency over such a short run. In addition, 4Ga would probably bind up when raising/lowering the motor throughout the day.

Also, from those paralleled batteries, I'll take a 4Ga run to my main distribution block/breaker panel, where it will be distributed over 12Ga to my electronics/lights/etc

As for the start battery, I'm forced to use 6Ga to the motor, as that is the largest wire I can get through the cowling.

If anyone thinks these may be bad plans, or has other suggestions for distribution, please chime in, I'm all ears on this one. I assume 12V DC is going to work the same in a boat as it did in a car, but If I need to step up (or down) my sizing, please let me know!!
Also, I'm considering a 4th small battery dedicated to lights/electronics, for two reasons
1: On the electronics side, I won't have any interference from the trolling motor
2: with the lights/electronics wired to their own battery (vs. the start battery) I don't run the chance of not being able to crank my outboard after pulling an all-nighter out on the lake ( I have pull started that little 30, but don't relish the idea of having to do it in the dark, where it's possible to step too far backward and into the drink)

Thanks again
Andrew


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## Zum (Sep 26, 2008)

I'm not sure sure how many amps a 46lbs.TM draws,it might be alittle more than 30 though...guessing 40amps.
I know some people that put their fishfinder on a seperate battery(just a small 12V)because of interference but I know others that only use 1 battery and have no trouble at all.I don't know how many amps a FF draws but it can't be much,probably wouldn't hurt the starting battery to much.On the other hand a small battery just for the FF wouldn't cost or weigh that much and it's nice to know theres enough power to start your motor.
I'm not to sure what the 60amp breaker between the batteries is for,,,,incase one shorts out?Could you explain it to me.


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## gifamilies (Sep 26, 2008)

Zum said:


> I'm not to sure what the 60amp breaker between the batteries is for,,,,incase one shorts out?Could you explain it to me.



The 60amp between the batteries is for precisely that, in case of shorts, and it never hurts anyway.


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## Zum (Sep 26, 2008)

Good one,I don't think I've ever seen it though.
If I go that route,I'll do the same.
The breaker only has to be as big as your biggest(s) draw?..probably


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## gifamilies (Sep 26, 2008)

Zum said:


> Good one,I don't think I've ever seen it though.
> If I go that route,I'll do the same.
> The breaker only has to be as big as your biggest(s) draw?..probably



I would think that it needs to be as large as all draws (that could possibly be turned on at the same time) together. Because I'll be using the batteries in parallel, and connecting to the pos of one battery and the neg term of the other, I'll potentially be drawing quite a bit of current across that link between the two batteries.


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## Zum (Sep 26, 2008)

Yup...my(s) didn't make sence to me either.


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## SlimeTime (Sep 26, 2008)

Here's a $100 livewell:

https://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/templates/product/standard-item.jsp?_DARGS=/cabelas/en/common/catalog/item-link.jsp_A&_DAV=&id=0001512012757a&navCount=0&podId=0001512&parentId=&masterpathid=&navAction=push&catalogCode=IJ&rid=&parentType=&indexId=&cmCat=netcon&cm_ven=netcon&cm_cat=Google&cm_pla=livewell%20cabellas&cm_ite=netcon

Judging by it's size, it wouldn't be too hard to remove the center seat (or part of it), mount the livewell (insulating it wouldn't be a bad idea either), and covering it with wood to regain the use of the seat. 

ST


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## gifamilies (Sep 27, 2008)

SlimeTime said:


> Here's a $100 livewell:
> 
> https://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/templates/product/standard-item.jsp?_DARGS=/cabelas/en/common/catalog/item-link.jsp_A&_DAV=&id=0001512012757a&navCount=0&podId=0001512&parentId=&masterpathid=&navAction=push&catalogCode=IJ&rid=&parentType=&indexId=&cmCat=netcon&cm_ven=netcon&cm_cat=Google&cm_pla=livewell%20cabellas&cm_ite=netcon
> 
> ...



You sir, are a genius!!

I'll have some more pictures up tommorrow evening, got all the electrical rough-run last night, and will start the framing when I get home this evening.
As an aside, has anyone used the Arm & Hammer waterproofing available at Wal-Mart??
It seems to be about the same mess as Thompson's water seal, but at least at my Wally World, it's more readily available.


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## gifamilies (Sep 30, 2008)

Quite a bit of work was accomplished over the weekend.
I've decided to go with all wood framing, as aluminum just proved to expensive for my budget.

Part of the mods will be to clean up the wiring, and I've decided to route all controls to the helm, where all switches will be mounted here



And that, will be placed where the wires are hanging out here



Some other improvements include the following


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## dedawg1149 (Sep 30, 2008)

doing good


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## Jim (Sep 30, 2008)

coming along really nice! :beer:


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## smoody (Oct 1, 2008)

Nice job, like the console!


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## SlimeTime (Oct 1, 2008)

Looks like it's coming right along! Be sure to take lots of pics & keep us updated!

ST


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## Waterwings (Oct 1, 2008)

Nice work! 8)


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## baptistpreach (Oct 5, 2008)

I'm liking your work so far! I'm modding out a jon too, so I love seeing the work in progress. I'm hoping maybe tomorrow I'll post pics of what I'm starting with, and what I'm doing. Most guys seem to want to make a bass boat, but I think mine's gonna be a crappie and cat boat primarily


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## SlimeTime (Oct 5, 2008)

baptistpreach said:


> Most guys seem to want to make a bass boat, but I think mine's gonna be a crappie and cat boat primarily



Welcome BP! I think it's as much for storage as anything. I'm with you though, hard to beat a nice crappie boat :wink: Post-up some pics of your boat & the mods.

ST


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## ben2go (Oct 5, 2008)

SlimeTime said:


> baptistpreach said:
> 
> 
> > Most guys seem to want to make a bass boat, but I think mine's gonna be a crappie and cat boat primarily
> ...




Nice crappie boat?What's crappie about it? :LMFAO: That's gonna be a crappie killer.No need to ask whats fur supper.The anwser is crappie. :LOL2: 

I don't care what anyone says.The boat is what catches fish. [-( :LOL22:


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## dedawg1149 (Oct 5, 2008)

baptistpreach said:


> I'm liking your work so far! I'm modding out a jon too, so I love seeing the work in progress. I'm hoping maybe tomorrow I'll post pics of what I'm starting with, and what I'm doing. Most guys seem to want to make a bass boat, but I think mine's gonna be a crappie and cat boat primarily


welcome aboard i am looking foward to see your crappie boat nothing like a mess of specks


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